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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 04:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GreenBeret


Actually the Corsair 3500 can't do 217 2-3-3-7 at stock volt 2.5. I've tried a few sticks. None of them can do that. THat's why Corsair guarantees the clock speed from 2.5~2.8V.
Well I have it at 2.8 so...
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 04:26 AM
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elusion keep up what ur doing cuz ur actually making me look on the bright side of things :P. Best to think positive i guess
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 04:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Galifrey

well I have now had mine up to 13x211fsb 2743mhz and I achieved that and no problems with POST by blasting an airconditioner over the NB....

can get the same results by leaving the pc off for a while... Thats with 2 sticks of corsair at 2-5-2-2 that previously gave me C1 errors...

Think the NB needs a fan for high fsb!
Who has 2 pc3500 sticks working?
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 04:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by eliteone
I really dont see why they dont just say "yes, pci is locked" or "no, pci is not locked"...just my .02
Yes, it makes sense, but they cant say they have it because PCI lock not REALLY a feature they have, they DO have AGP lock, and the pci is 1/2 agp. Thus there is, in an indirect way PCI lock, its just tied into the AGP lock. Because of Epox's  NDA's they are not allowed to talk about it.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 04:46 AM
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on anandtech's review of serveral different nf2 boards they said how some companies said they had a pci lock and how others said they didn't....it must just be an epox thing not to tell.

personally i think it is stupid as the board is out right now and anyone with measureing equipment could give an answer. so i personaly think they should dispel all current rumors and just get it outta the way instead.

but then again doesn't sound like they will so i guess we might as well stop askin them and wait till someone can test it with the proper equipment.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 05:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by whoreable
on anandtech's review of serveral different nf2 boards they said how some companies said they had a pci lock and how others said they didn't....it must just be an epox thing not to tell.

personally i think it is stupid as the board is out right now and anyone with measureing equipment could give an answer. so i personaly think they should dispel all current rumors and just get it outta the way instead.

but then again doesn't sound like they will so i guess we might as well stop askin them and wait till someone can test it with the proper equipment.
Like I said b4 I understand why you guys are a bit shall I say Perturbed. I asked twice, and was probably on the verge of getting banned. I personally think this is the best advice yet:

"but then again doesn't sound like they will so i guess we might as well stop askin them and wait till someone can test it with the proper equipment."

JMHO
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 06:04 AM
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Just to clear things up:

1) Some Nforce2 boards have PCI locks, confirmed by the manufacturers, and some do not, also confirmed by the manufacturers. This is straight from Anandtech's review. Asus & Chaintech do, Leadtek & MSI do not. Epox & Abit are unknowns, they haven't given clear yes/no responses.

2) The only Nforce board that I've known to be hardware-tested for the PCI lock is the Asus. That post is on NforcersHQ.com, and the testing was done with a PC Geiger tool. No test results for the Epox have been posted anywhere to my knowledge.

3) The Nforce2 chipset seems to be able to support independent clocks for FSB, AGP & PCI. AGP *does not* have to be 2x PCI, as evidenced by bios settings that still allow the locked PCI boards to overclock the AGP bus.


The reason no one knows yet about the Epox board is because there isn't any software benchmarking tool which can measure PCI bandwidth reliably. If we could do that, then it'd be easy to tell an overclocked bus by the increase in bandwidth.

The problem is that it's very hard to saturate the 133Mb/s PCI bus. I found one application which tries to do it by writing to PCI video card memory, but that's been inconclusive so far. Perhaps someone an Ultra160 scsi card could do it ... do they even make those for 32-bit PCI?

I think the only way we'll know for sure is if someone actually uses an oscilloscope to measure the PCI frequency at high FSB's.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 07:26 AM
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1. This discussion should not be taking place in this topic, period.

2. This discussion CAN and is welcome to take place in our "AMD Motherboard and CPU Topics"

3 No one besides myself opens closes or moves posts in this forum.

4. I "Most often" (not always) will do any of these things if asked by ET or Holst in the EPoX Topic. OR by staff or membership, in all Topics when OUR rules are being broken.

I try very hard NOT to break them myself and expect that those who mean AOA well will do the same.

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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by whoreable
on anandtech's review of serveral different nf2 boards they said how some companies said they had a pci lock and how others said they didn't....it must just be an epox thing not to tell.

personally i think it is stupid as the board is out right now and anyone with measureing equipment could give an answer. so i personaly think they should dispel all current rumors and just get it outta the way instead.

but then again doesn't sound like they will so i guess we might as well stop askin them and wait till someone can test it with the proper equipment.
I would like to see The manufacture say this, rather than Anantech say they said this. You guys aren't the only one's who use pressure tactics to get the information you want":O}
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 10:25 AM
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Dan,

thanks for moving this thread here instead of being locked or deleted.
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 10:58 AM
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Hey debate and controversy are often the life's blood of a forum. ":O}
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 12:55 PM
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Just to point out that I tried running my memory at very agressive timings at 166 (1,1,1,2) and I got some corrupt files on my HDD.
Pretty stupid thing to do, good job I made a ghost.

Norton ghost is bundled with the board I suggest everybody who is overclocking on 8RDA+ uses it to backup before overclocking.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ckevin
Just to clear things up:

1) Some Nforce2 boards have PCI locks, confirmed by the manufacturers, and some do not, also confirmed by the manufacturers. This is straight from Anandtech's review. Asus & Chaintech do, Leadtek & MSI do not. Epox & Abit are unknowns, they haven't given clear yes/no responses.

The problem is that it's very hard to saturate the 133Mb/s PCI bus. I found one application which tries to do it by writing to PCI video card memory, but that's been inconclusive so far. Perhaps someone an Ultra160 scsi card could do it ... do they even make those for 32-bit PCI?
Most Ultra160 SCSI cards are 64bit/66MHz PCI. Fortunately, such cards will operate quite happily on 32bit/33MHz PCI. I just don't happen to have an 8RDA board to test my Ultra160 controller on.

Anandtech also made mention of the fact that they did NOT confirm what the manufacturer said. In fact, they said...

Quote:
. We have no way of independently verifying this ourselves, so take it for what it's worth.
Interestingly enough, the EPoX was the best overclocker, which would suggest that if it doesn't have a PCI lock, the dividers in use are close enough for it not to be an issue. Could this be why EPoX are not saying anything?

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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 01:58 PM
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I don't think the PCI clock on the nForce2 boards is devided from the FSB simply because the FSB is controlled by SPP/NB and the PCI are controlled by the MCP/SB.
I tried a special PCI card that only shows the clock of the PCI and it shows 33-34MHz all the time, no matter if I run 133MHz FSB or 211MHz FSB.
So I think that the PCI is always locked to 33.33MHz.
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Old 6th December, 2002, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alexandrus
I don't think the PCI clock on the nForce2 boards is devided from the FSB simply because the FSB is controlled by SPP/NB and the PCI are controlled by the MCP/SB.
I tried a special PCI card that only shows the clock of the PCI and it shows 33-34MHz all the time, no matter if I run 133MHz FSB or 211MHz FSB.
So I think that the PCI is always locked to 33.33MHz.
I thought it was tied into the AGP , being 1/2 of AGP. Did you have AGP locked at 66 ? If so, can you raise it , then all these burning  questions will be answered.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 6th December, 2002, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Alexandrus
I don't think the PCI clock on the nForce2 boards is devided from the FSB simply because the FSB is controlled by SPP/NB and the PCI are controlled by the MCP/SB.
I tried a special PCI card that only shows the clock of the PCI and it shows 33-34MHz all the time, no matter if I run 133MHz FSB or 211MHz FSB.
So I think that the PCI is always locked to 33.33MHz.
That sounds promising! Alexandrus, which Nforce2 board did you test the PCI card on? Can you post a picture?
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 7th December, 2002, 12:22 AM
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My understanding of Hyper Transport, which is used by nVidia, is that PCI is ALWAYS 33 unless you specifically override the value. In other words, PCI IS tied to the Hyper Transport bus and is "locked" in nForce2 at 33. You would need a PCI "unlock" to change to anything else (if this would even work on that bus, which I don't know). Hyper Transport also specs an INDEPENDENT AGP setting not tied to PCI - probably because nVidia is a video card maker and had influence on AMD's Hyper Transport spec. AMD, Intel and others have stated many times that there is no point to overclocking the PCI bus anyway, since it does not increase system performance.

This is very different from our VIA, SiS, and Intel chipset functioning where PCI is by definition half of AGP.

We also learned long ago that aggressive memory timings at high bus speeds can cause harddrive corruption. Specifically, if you are over 200FSB you want to be using 6 or 7 and NOT 5. On both Intel and SiS chipsets using Corsair, 5 corrupts the harddrive. 6,2,2,2 is usually safe with the best memory over DDR400 (over 200), but 5,3,3,3 can cause HD corruption. The important number for harddrive problems is the top one. I often find 7, 2, 3, 2 to yield the best memory performace with Corsair XMS over 200 - but benchmark it for yourself.

I really don't believe high PCI is causing the problems here - it is more likely unbalanced memory timings for >200 FSB with synch memory.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 7th December, 2002, 02:04 AM
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I cannot post a picture because that would mean that I have to take a pciture of the board running inside the case and the PCI card showing the PCI clock on it's digital disaply(it looks something like the P80P leds on the EPoX boards). Problem is no digital camera for me yet

BTW, I udes the 8RDA+ as the test board, played around with AGP clock and FSB and that didn't affect the PCI clock at all.
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