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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12th November, 2003, 05:34 AM
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NF7s v2- Anyone know how to backup striped Raptors without running a 0 + 1 array?

I am awaiting delivery of dual Raptors tomorrow (Bob grins ), I can't wait to load up Winxp pro on a striped array and see how fast I can render some video clips. My quest is to backup this raid0 array without using mirroring ( RAID 0 + 1 ). I have a Maxtor 80GB UDMA6 to do it with. Can I just backup the array everyday without including this drive in the active mix, I might be wrong, but from the little bit I've read about RAID, If I run 0 + 1 array , the throughput will only be as fast as the slowest drive , on the other hand striping will get me transfer rates through the roof , but I would like to back up my data, video, audio etc...Any ideas ?
Bob
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Old 12th November, 2003, 10:46 AM
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RAID 0+1, if implemented properly (!! BIG GOTCHA !!), will result in read speeds easily in excess of a RAID 0 array. The problem is the number of controllers and drives that implement RAID 0+1 properly is pretty low.

In terms of backing up, it's probably best to have the backup drive not normally connected. In the case of a virus or other glitch (like your PSU frying your PC!), the data on the backup drive would not affected.
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Old 12th November, 2003, 08:26 PM
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I leave my back up drive connected but disabled in the BIOS,
I've been assuming that this will do the trick....does this protect my back-up from infection?
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Old 12th November, 2003, 09:35 PM
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If you are using onboard sata, I don't think 0+1 is an option, since you can only have 2 drives in the array.
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Old 12th November, 2003, 09:41 PM
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No, I'm not using SATA, just olde Time-y Promise Fasttrack.":O}
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Old 13th November, 2003, 04:28 AM
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*POST EDIT*

This post contains what many might well cosider a racial slur. Please think twice befor post!


Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveI
If you are using onboard sata, I don't think 0+1 is an option, since you can only have 2 drives in the array.
Steve , I think you are correct. The manual should state that the NF7-S supports Striped <OR> mirrored RAID sets. And should say that striped <OR> mirrored RAID set requires 2 hard drives. I guess I have to learn how to translate ****** ( what most manuals are written in these days, heck, most days) a little better. I am going to try with the 2 drives for striped array and then add the backup hard drive and try to copy the whole OS using Partition Commander/System Commander, then disable the backup as suggested, If that works then I could probably get away with a smaller,slower HDD for this purpose. Video editing might be faster without RAID , just by using 2 SATA HDD, with 1 for the OS and 1 for the scratch disk. I have a long weekend ahead. Thanks for your replies.
Bob
Attached Thumbnails
NF7s v2- Anyone know how to backup striped Raptors without running a 0 + 1 array?-raid-instructions.jpg  
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Old 13th November, 2003, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timbob2469
*POST EDIT*

This post contains what many might well cosider a racial slur. Please think twice befor post!



Steve , I think you are correct. The manual should state that the NF7-S supports Striped <OR> mirrored RAID sets. And should say that striped <OR> mirrored RAID set requires 2 hard drives. I guess I have to learn how to translate ****** ( what most manuals are written in these days, heck, most days) a little better. I am going to try with the 2 drives for striped array and then add the backup hard drive and try to copy the whole OS using Partition Commander/System Commander, then disable the backup as suggested, If that works then I could probably get away with a smaller,slower HDD for this purpose. Video editing might be faster without RAID , just by using 2 SATA HDD, with 1 for the OS and 1 for the scratch disk. I have a long weekend ahead. Thanks for your replies.
Bob
Bob, as a suggestion it wont be amazingly quick but norton ghost the raid and save the image on a third drive/DVD-RW?
Likely to be what ill be doing... at least till I can afford 4 raptors and an SATA card with 4 ports
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Old 14th November, 2003, 06:29 AM
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Umm, sorry. It was not meant as a slur, it is just that most manuals seem to contain a mixture of Chinese and English and is/are somewhat misleading. Anyway part 1 is done:
OK , here I have it running now real nice. This is what I did after researching it for 2 hours last night before building. I found a review on the Raptor SATA hard drives and the article said to leave the jumpers in the default position as they shipped, which turns out to be pins 1 and 2. The other settings don't do anything, but if jumper is not set to pins 1 and 2 it won't boot, I trusted the article and didn't test for non-boot. Article is here:
http://www.overclockers.com.au/article.php?id=179581
I installed the drives in my generic case in 2 adjoining 3.5" drive bays, I had already mounted an 80mm cooling fan in the front of the case to draw air in. I connected the 2 drives with the serialATA cables and plugged in 1 molex connector from the first drop of two different power feed lines from my Antec True Control 550watt psu. I booted up and went into bios setup, enabled SATA on the ONBOARD PCI DEVICES page, checked for floppy for first boot device on ADVANCED BIOS FEATURES page. Everything else had been set when I ran and tested the board with a Maxtor plus 9 80GB hdd.
When I booted up I had to press f4 and choose my RAID set (RAID 0-Striped, and chunk size 16k)
I rebooted with floppy 1 of 6 for winxp pro install set, I had to press F6 within the first minute or so to give notice that I was going to install a raid driver or controller, I was not prompted for that driver disk until the middle of loading disk 4 of the setup disks, I put that in and chose my OS and type of controller ( Winxp pro and Silicon Image SIL 3112), then back to disk 4 thru 6, then Winxp Pro CD, after a couple of restarts and about 20 more minutes I loaded the Abit drivers, slipstreamed Service Pack !( already had it on cd ), Loaded Catalyst drivers, and did windows update. Today I started loading some benchmark apps , after further testing I will Put in another hard drive and see if I can copy what is already there for backup purposes, that should work right? I have read where some people have built their RAID set from an existing OS on an IDE hard drive. I will try System/Partition Commander , if that doesn't work I'll try Norton ghost. I might have missed reporting something I set, but the reason it was set right is because you people have posted how to do it in other threads and I was using my now backup pc to search for the answers as the questions came up. Thank You.
Bob
Attached Thumbnails
NF7s v2- Anyone know how to backup striped Raptors without running a 0 + 1 array?-raptors100.jpg  
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Old 14th November, 2003, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timbob2469
Umm, sorry. It was not meant as a slur, it is just that most manuals seem to contain a mixture of Chinese and English and is/are somewhat misleading. Anyway part 1 is done:
OK , here I have it running now real nice. This is what I did after researching it for 2 hours last night before building. I found a review on the Raptor SATA hard drives and the article said to leave the jumpers in the default position as they shipped, which turns out to be pins 1 and 2. The other settings don't do anything, but if jumper is not set to pins 1 and 2 it won't boot, I trusted the article and didn't test for non-boot. Article is here:
http://www.overclockers.com.au/article.php?id=179581
I installed the drives in my generic case in 2 adjoining 3.5" drive bays, I had already mounted an 80mm cooling fan in the front of the case to draw air in. I connected the 2 drives with the serialATA cables and plugged in 1 molex connector from the first drop of two different power feed lines from my Antec True Control 550watt psu. I booted up and went into bios setup, enabled SATA on the ONBOARD PCI DEVICES page, checked for floppy for first boot device on ADVANCED BIOS FEATURES page. Everything else had been set when I ran and tested the board with a Maxtor plus 9 80GB hdd.
When I booted up I had to press f4 and choose my RAID set (RAID 0-Striped, and chunk size 16k)
I rebooted with floppy 1 of 6 for winxp pro install set, I had to press F6 within the first minute or so to give notice that I was going to install a raid driver or controller, I was not prompted for that driver disk until the middle of loading disk 4 of the setup disks, I put that in and chose my OS and type of controller ( Winxp pro and Silicon Image SIL 3112), then back to disk 4 thru 6, then Winxp Pro CD, after a couple of restarts and about 20 more minutes I loaded the Abit drivers, slipstreamed Service Pack !( already had it on cd ), Loaded Catalyst drivers, and did windows update. Today I started loading some benchmark apps , after further testing I will Put in another hard drive and see if I can copy what is already there for backup purposes, that should work right? I have read where some people have built their RAID set from an existing OS on an IDE hard drive. I will try System/Partition Commander , if that doesn't work I'll try Norton ghost. I might have missed reporting something I set, but the reason it was set right is because you people have posted how to do it in other threads and I was using my now backup pc to search for the answers as the questions came up. Thank You.
Bob
Bob, sounds like your well underway, only thing I might suggest is you get a copy of the XP CD that self boots, might make life a bit easier (and as U got a license you can have 1 copy in any form U like)
You done any hard disk benches? Will be interesting to compare SATA 10000, 7200 and 7200 ATA with the converter see how much of a difference there is.

Edit: doh... spot the big piccy attachment at the bottom... ill shut up now heh
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Old 14th November, 2003, 06:32 PM
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timbob2469 Posted:

"Umm, sorry. It was not meant as a slur, it is just that most manuals seem to contain a mixture of Chinese and English and is/are somewhat misleading."

You've never been less than a gentleman and have always shown respect and consideration of our membership.

Yet we live in times that require the utmost caution if consideration is to be shown where so often only bigotry reared it's ugly head in the past.

Glad we see eye to eye on this one ":O}
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Old 14th November, 2003, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timbob2469
OK , here I have it running now real nice.
Interesting. Heres a benchie for a couple of SATA Maxtor DM9's on RAID0. Results are very similar
Attached Thumbnails
NF7s v2- Anyone know how to backup striped Raptors without running a 0 + 1 array?-raid0-atto-081103-fat32-copy.jpg  
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Old 16th November, 2003, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dod
Interesting. Heres a benchie for a couple of SATA Maxtor DM9's on RAID0. Results are very similar
Yes, I've seen how using just benchmarks can lead one to believe that the extra 2800 rpm's doesn't make a difference. The real test is everyday, real world use.
Since this is the first time I ever implemented RAID , I know I have a steep learning curve. If anyone is interested in learning more about RAID, here is a link to a good article:

The link in the previous post forwarned of the seemingly low throughput of the Raptors compared just as in this thread. There is a leadup article pointing out the differences of the 7200 rpm drives and the 10,000 rpm drives here that that indicates how those extra rpm's come into play.So far , I know that my new rig really flies, it boots up from a cold start to internet access in about 30 seconds. Now it's back to tweaking, I have to see if I can copy my OS from the RAID set onto an IDE drive. And then back again but with different stripe size. Abit or I guess Silicon Image calls it a "chunk" size.
Bob
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