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AMD Motherboards & CPUs Questions or comments on AMD products?


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 21st August, 2005, 03:41 PM
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Ok What one is best for gaming??

Hi guys thinking of getting a new CPU however what one would be best for gameing both are about my budget and I want to stick with AMD so no intel crap

Ok first up is the San Diego 64 4000+
Second idea was the 64 X2 Dual Core 3800+

both cost about the same and I will be running just the standard version of windows XP so what would you guys recomend to use to run the next gen games?

Oh just to let you know I'm currently running a AMD 64 3000+ Winchester

Cheers dudes
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Old 21st August, 2005, 03:46 PM
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At stock without a doubt the Sand Diego for the time being, at least until games start making use of multi cores.

Even overclocked, the 3800's from the reviews I've seen top out at 2.4-2.5ghz, so can't compete directly with the San diego core which along with it's larger cache will overclock 2.7-2.9ghz

I would still be inclined to go dual core though, unless benchmark results are what you are after, as presently both cores are more than up to the task of current games, and future games will take advantage of dual cores

I think you need Windows XP Pro for dual cores though
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Old 21st August, 2005, 04:55 PM
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oh yeah forgot to say I do have xp pro just not xp64 i take it that the x2 should be slightly quicker than the 3000 i have at the mo
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Old 21st August, 2005, 05:16 PM
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Single core wise, yeah it's 200mhz faster, though overclocking will probably be a little less than your winchester (unless your board is the limitting factor) but you have the obvious benefit of 2 cores
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Old 21st August, 2005, 06:31 PM
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Well I will be using the Asus SLI delux board I'm a bit scard on the whole overclocking thing at the mo but may give it a wiz
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Old 21st August, 2005, 06:50 PM
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well i would stik with the dual core, mainly cos i think it would be a great cpu to use with 64 bit linux, and 64 bit win 2003 server(i'd rather this one than xp pro, it has less glitches, and run faster for me).And the obvious benefits of dual cores, are: u can burn a dvd and play a game without any worries, if u go on to 2 screens setup, the dual also helps, virtually your are going to have one cpu for each monitor. #) still sounds great for me.

The 4000+ san diego has a big deal for games, it's 1mb cache per core really helps a lot, and it's the best way to take all advantages of nvidia series 6800 gt and up cards.

mainly, both things will do, but if u do multiple tasks more than play games, dual can help u #)
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Old 21st August, 2005, 07:36 PM
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The 4000+ is a good 25% faster with single threads, but unless you are playing something extremely cpu limitted it's not a big deal, you'll still get 100+ fps with a decent video card, unless benchmark scores are what you are after then the X2 will serve you better all round and also have more of a future

How come you're scared of overclocking?
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Old 21st August, 2005, 07:42 PM
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not sure I think I still belive the old wife tail of things dieing when you push them I have a big heat sink and fan so may give it a whirl. I havnt a clue what I'm doing though! Although the Asus did have AI overclocking (not sure how good that was)
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Old 21st August, 2005, 07:52 PM
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You can pretty much guarantee, that clockspeed alone will not cause any damage to components.

There is no differance between a part AMD tags to run at 2ghz or 2.4ghz, it's all down to market demand. If you are really cautious about it then just don't increase the voltage, as it is this that lowers the lifespan and potentially kills chips, but even then not when only small increases are applied.

A small increase to 2.4ghz, with little to no extra voltage is harmless, I can't ever think of a case where someone has lost components due to overclocking unless they do something crazy like sticking too high a voltage through it.

Myself, my friends and family have been running overclocked systems for the past 8 years, some as high as 60% overclocks, and I've never seen one fail
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Old 21st August, 2005, 11:19 PM
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If you are worried about the CPU and want more performance, buy a watercooling system. For similar money to a 4000+ or 3800+ you can get a corsair or asetec water cooling kit, that will be stable and perform extremely well (koolance and thermaltake bigwater also rate).

A CPU is a part that depreciates rapidly and is worth squat very quickly. A watercooling system however is an investment.

Your WC unit will last you maybe 6 or 7 systems, and it will mean every CPU you buy will go 30-40% faster than stock when you get it. The 3000+ on water will hit similar speeds to the 4000+ on air, and if you use good quality ram, it may perform better.
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 05:05 AM
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Why overclock a perfectly good setup. There is really no need to oc unless you are doing it just to see what you can get out of it. That's cool I do it. However, you need to find out what your cpu can do with default settings because sooner or later, you wil be tweaking it down close to the defaults anyhow. Sure there is a few viable chips that can do some kik arse O'cing but the gap is closing. Now back to the subject at hand. I have a ASUS Sli Delux and I tell you it is an awesome board and decent clocking abilities. Dual Core is not really needed right now for practically any games out there. The difference in price versus the quality you will see IHMO does not add up. Besides, the ASUS Sli is upgradeable wiht out having to buy all new stuff again later when prices drop down. I have a single core 64 3800 and I am extremely pleased with the abilities I can do. No problems with any game or program I want to run. Make sure you get a good video card like the Nvidia GE Force 6800 GT (EVGA) or the 7800 series. If our ATI fan, go with the X850 series. Make sure you get PCI-X. For ram, I would recommend no less than 2 512 sticks of high quality ram such as Corsair XMS Series Dual Channel PC3200 or if you can get 4 x512 sticks and run dual channel. I for got to mention, This board is not limited to 2 slots for dual channel. You can fill all the slots and as long as they are the same modules and speed and size, they will be dual channel Oh how sweet it is. everyone will offer you advice and if you really wantto know some good information, you come to the right spot. However, I would suggest that you put a maximum amount of USD you can spend so the best pricing and quality can be given to you.
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamGarside
You can pretty much guarantee, that clockspeed alone will not cause any damage to components.
Ahem, You sure about this? I would not ever make such a strong statement as this, especially to people that are seekign help and may not have as much knowledge of overclocking as this member asked about in his beginning thread. I haev personally seen MOBO chip slots melt, chips fry and all sorts of instability. Overclocking is a real danger to those that are not fully knowledgable on how to do this. Clocking is a 1 to 1 ratio or it is not ture ocing.
I am not questioning your knowledge, only the statement.
Respectfully,
SkyDiver
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 22nd August, 2005, 07:55 AM
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Ok I am leaning towards an X2 at the mo due to it have more life for future games but will this perform any quicker than the 3000+ I have at the moment? Also what do you need to change when OC'ing if you do not touch the volts?
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyDiver
MOBO chip slots melt, chips fry and all sorts of instability.
Respectfully,
SkyDiver
How many volts did it have running through it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamGarside
I can't ever think of a case where someone has lost components due to overclocking unless they do something crazy like sticking too high a voltage through it.
I even enlarged it for you.
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 10:49 AM
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Im sure the lifespan is effected tho
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 10:51 AM
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Pure clock speed increases will not do any physical or irreverseable damage, only instability. Running a PCI bus out of sync runs the risk of corrupting hard disk data, but that is about the worst case scenario.

The performance gains from overclocking Athlon 64s are very real. My 3200+ runs 2Ghz stock, and runs at 2.8Ghz when its cold, 2.6Ghz stable all day long. That is a very considerable performance gain.

Furthermore, when using Athlon 64s with high end DDR, you can increase DDR performance by up to 50%. That coupled with clock speed means that it will severely own anything on the market.

Fast CPUs are nice, but when a 2.0 runs at 2.6 out of the box with complete stability, it makes you wonder why people buy 4000+ CPUs and run them at stock.

Investing in a water cooler which lets you run your CPU 30-50% above stock speeds means that in every CPU generation, you can buy the base model, and have performance better than the top model.

There are risks, but a high strung CPU in the hands of an experienced overclocker will always have a happier life than a stock CPU in the hands of someone who does not know how to treat it.

Pitch of course, is the exception to this.

As for the reduction in lifespan, going from 12 years down to 8 years does not really matter when the chip is worthless after 3 years. If it is cooled well, the lifespan could even be extended over that of a CPU that has run all day in a small case in a hot office.
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyDiver
Ahem, You sure about this? I would not ever make such a strong statement as this, especially to people that are seekign help and may not have as much knowledge of overclocking as this member asked about in his beginning thread. I haev personally seen MOBO chip slots melt, chips fry and all sorts of instability. Overclocking is a real danger to those that are not fully knowledgable on how to do this. Clocking is a 1 to 1 ratio or it is not ture ocing.
I am not questioning your knowledge, only the statement.
Respectfully,
SkyDiver
If you don't know what your doing I agree, you can potentially damage components overclocking (well increasing the voltages to gain stability)

But my statement was that clockspeed alone will cause no harm, and I stand by that rather bold statement. Clockspeed only increases temperatures by small amounts, nothing that could potentially harm anything, it's the voltage that does it, and if someone wants to play it safe then they can stick to little or no extra voltage and see what they can get.
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrahamGarside
If you don't know what your doing I agree, you can potentially damage components overclocking (well increasing the voltages to gain stability)

But my statement was that clockspeed alone will cause no harm, and I stand by that rather bold statement. Clockspeed only increases temperatures by small amounts, nothing that could potentially harm anything, it's the voltage that does it, and if someone wants to play it safe then they can stick to little or no extra voltage and see what they can get.
Your welcome for the bolded statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsio
Pitch of course, is the exception to this.
Your really are cruel. There is a limit that people say "alright thats enough pushing of this chip." Pitch knows this limit, and only pushes harder when he hits it. LOL. Just kidding mate. No hard feelings?
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 12:40 PM
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Cheers
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Old 22nd August, 2005, 12:48 PM
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ok so just increase the clock speeds? I have a good cooler on there so shouldnt be a problem decided to oc my 3000 and get 2gb of better ram
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