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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 1st April, 2003, 11:38 PM
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Peltier

I got talking with a friend of mine about peltiers, and he told me he has a couple extras and that he could sell me one. He said "its the biggest one coleman had in their coolers" (assuming the little beer cooler). he said he'd sell it to me for 30$ canadian.
naturally i know nothing about peletiers.
he told me i needed a big enough HSF to take the heat off the hot side, and that i should have foam around the area (and a shim on the processor).

Has anyone travelled this route before? is it dangerous? :<
and does anyone have any advice and/or a guide that i could have a look at before i dive in?
thanks!
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 02:19 AM
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you need to find out exactly how big it is... the 80w that i put in my chiller is useless for cooling

my opinion skip the pelt go for water
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 02:21 AM
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really? im on a budget however.
pelt --> cost me about 30$ plus the foam and dialectric grease, silicone, etc. which i have already.
watercooling --> cost me about 250-300 canadian for a good setup ;p

also, pelt seems easier to me. you're the expert though, i've never gone water or pelt =)...
or direct die for that matter ;>
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 02:32 AM
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if you working with-in a budget then go for the pelt, I'm sure it will be an interesting experience

i had a ton of fun with mine first time out

just don't leave it unattended
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 02:58 AM
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yeah, the guy told me to keep it in bios for the first couple of hours.
is there a way to moderate the voltage to it to control the output?
i dont want it running with ice on it (unless i've got it sealed FOR SURE)

im hoping it would be a fun experience, i've been reading alot about it, and it looks pretty simple. I was thinking of:

shim on the processor
a home-made neoprene gasket around the pelt and cpu.
dialectric grease between to make sure everything is ok
and of course having it wired to my nexus panel.
=)

ps. had to add the last part about the nexus in because i just ordered it.
rawr.
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 03:08 AM
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shims..i can do with out

dielectric grease... is good

two sided sticky foam ...good for the back

hand made foam gasket for the front ...big plus

sounds like you have a well thought out plan
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 03:13 AM
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really no shim? my buddy told me that would be necessary.
the sticky foam.. i have some, but one side is sticky. should i put that on the back of my mobo socket?
also, my board doesnt have the 4 mounting points for a big HSF. (or block).

only the standard AMD clips..well actually they have 3 prongs on each side
it's an MSI kt3v (kt333 w/ barton support)
got any advice for me kat? possibly a guide =)

or some diagrams would help, hehe

edit:
another thing kat, would an OCZ goliath 2 SE be enough to take care of the hot side of the peltier? it's all copper, small fins, lots of them. i'll have the fan at max rpm (3500) at 44.6 CFM.
=) im assuming the peltier is close to 125~ watts
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 03:50 AM
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i really have my doubt's....

I'm really not a big fan of pelts

the only way to tell is to try it
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 03:54 AM
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i think i might just go water then. im still in a big thinking period here ;<
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 04:02 AM
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if you look around and do some of the fabricating your self i think you might be surprised at just how cheap water can be
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 04:04 AM
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yeah, was thinking that...
the plus side is with water, a pelt would also be possible and maybe it would be safer? =)
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 10:58 AM
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The biggest problems with Peltier effect devices is that they're heat pumps. That's also their biggest advantage.

They can only pump so much heat (depending on their power). If your processor kicks out more heat than the Peltier can pump, guess what happens. Yup, the processor gets hotter and hotter until it (or the Peltier) fails. So, you need to ensure that the Peltier is suitable for your CPU.

Secondly, they're not 100% efficient. What this means is that they produce heat themselves whilst pumping. Your method of removing heat must be capable of removing the CPU's heat output PLUS the peltier's heat output. This is a much more demanding task than just cooling the CPU. If I took my CPU and cooled it with a peltier, the heat removal system would have to remove the CPU's heat (60W), plus the Peltier's heat (80W). That's a total of 140W. If I used the same heatsink that was originally on the CPU, it would be at a scorching 81C! That kind of temperature is high enough to kill a Peltier, and hence my CPU.

The other thing to remember is that the Peltier requires power. If it's a high powered Peltier, chances are that your existing PSU won't be able to power it!

The condensation issue I'll leave to you.

Áedán
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 11:32 AM
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I dont mean to be blunt but

THIS WILL NOT WORK.

you cannot successfully air cool a peltier on your CPU without going to a huge ammount of trouble, and even if you do the results will not be particually good.

You wont get any condensation as it will just overheat.
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 02:47 PM
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From reading everything here, plus my own knowledge of pelts, I don't think it will work.. Well, at least not with out a beefy heatsink that requires four holes (ThermalRight SLK800/900U) or a watercooler, that also needs the holes... It's going to be damned hard to mount a pelt without holes.. Might be able to do it, but I'd save my money and wait until I have the right parts..
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by chris4521
another thing kat, would an OCZ goliath 2 SE be enough to take care of the hot side of the peltier? it's all copper, small fins, lots of them. i'll have the fan at max rpm (3500) at 44.6 CFM.
=) im assuming the peltier is close to 125~ watts
Do some rough calculations.

Run your heatsink and fan at that level, and measure the temperature. Then, work out the difference between your CPU temp, and your room temp. Call that CPUDelta.

Now, work out how much heat your CPU puts out - you can probably look that up (radiate or similar program). Divide the heat output by the temperature difference (CPUDelta). Call that CW.

Now, add together the heat output from the CPU and the heat output from the Peltier (125W). Call that TotalHeat. Multiply the TotalHeat by the CW you got earlier.

Now you've got a very approximate figure for how hot the peltier will get, and how much heat the heatsink will have to deal with.

Áedán
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 05:38 PM
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125watt peltier (output wattage) wont be enough anyway.

From what ive read they are 60-70% efficent (70 is very generous)

So that only gives you a 75watt pelt.

Say your athlon produces 60watts at stock, you wont be able to iuncrease your votlage at all and even at stock you wont get very good temps.

The only way to get significantly lower temps than straight air cooling will be to use a bigger pelt, most people recomend double your CPU wattage.. say 85watts overclocked .... so a 175watt pelt (pumping capacity) so taking account of ineficency you will need to shift 300watts + your CPU.

Onlya fool would try to cool a 385watt heat scource with a heatsink, even a SLK900 with a 120mm delta 200cfm would be a serious struggle plus you will go deaf.

Water is the only way..
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Old 2nd April, 2003, 05:43 PM
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I know this sounds liek im trying to rubbish your idea,

But im 100% certain it wont work...

I have seen it done once by a guy on OC.com forums but even he admitted that it was more trouble than it was worth plus he had a CPU that would overclock without adding any voltage.. pretty unusual.

That sort of peltier might come in handy elsewhere... GPU is my first thought.. air cooling may be possible on a GPU...
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Old 3rd April, 2003, 04:41 AM
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yeah, i've decided to go water.
and from there i can possibly do pelt
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Old 3rd April, 2003, 10:25 AM
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Yep, thats the best plan.

If youget a decent watercooled system up and running adding a peltier is easyer to do..

Let us know how your watercooling goes.
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Old 4th April, 2003, 12:14 AM
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will do...
may be in a while though, i have some financial...lets say "setbacks" i have to go through first =)
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