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Old 6th September, 2004, 09:06 PM
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Question How hot is dangerously hot?

I want to overclock my radeon 9600 to as fast as i can get it to go. im planning on picking up a zalman ZM80-D HP and get a temperature monitor for my PC, but i dont know what temp. it will fry at, so i am hesitent to overclock it at all yet. can someone please help me??
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Old 6th September, 2004, 10:46 PM
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Generally speaking, you don't want to let your GPU get over about 60C, I don't think. At least, that's the impression I've gotten, but I could be wrong. Someone else should drop by, and they may have a better idea than I.

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Old 6th September, 2004, 11:10 PM
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Im never sure about this eigther, My X800pro gets to 75 degrees celsius! but apparently this is in the "Normal" operating range? so im not sure? All i can say is that you can start to overclock but the minute you see artifacts back off!

Cadaveca should see this and hes pretty good with graphics cards, lets hope he drops by.
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Old 6th September, 2004, 11:28 PM
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rv350/1..... 75c critical
r350/r360....75c critical
r420 100c safe 125 critical


9600xt's cannot go as high reliably becuase of the on-chip temp sensor.

9800 pro's/xt's are ok to 70c, but not for long past 65c.

x800's are good too 100c full load no prob....125 you'll get damage.


these temps directly relate to a 15c testing "vacuum box"
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Old 6th September, 2004, 11:29 PM
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So mines fine and dandy at 75 degrees?
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Old 6th September, 2004, 11:32 PM
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should be.
that's with an added 20 from the temp sensor(your reading) real temp would be abt 10c less, but that depends on alot of factors.

as long as you are not suppling more voltage to the chip, then yes, you are ok, but keep in mind that the higher the voltage you give a gpu, the lower the temps need to be for it to operate most effectively. the 420's can go higher because they are a lower wattage chip. this is why the mobiles are such sought after chips...lower wattage mean higher possible temps.(or at least i have come to understand. Although cpu's and gpu's are essential the same, they are just as different as they are alike)
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Old 7th September, 2004, 01:58 AM
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i just ran the ATITool 0.0.20 find max core speed and it came up with 440.31 MHs out of my bad 9600 SE. i think that this is an extremely high # with the stock heatsink (no fan). what do you guys think? im not keeping it at that speed right now, thats just what it said it got to without finding artifacts. can you guys give me some pointers so that i dont roast my card because if i do my mom will kill me. seriously. and all u guys have aftermarket temp. sensors on ur cards right? or are they built in. if so, how do you check the temps? thanks. ( sorry if i confused anyone with that terrible writing)
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Old 7th September, 2004, 02:40 AM
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The 9600 is a relatively cool gpu. It is based on low wattage, about .13micron process. That's why your se doesn't even have a fan... They really don't need it. The higher speed of the xt necessitates the fan, but without extra juice I wouldn't worry about frying the card. As long as the case has decent ventilation, I highly doubt you can fry the card from overclocking it (without added volts).
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Old 7th September, 2004, 03:08 AM
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ok thanks alot. but when i say fry i mean damage it by pushing it too hard. sorry if u thought that was something else. the case has fairly decent ventalation. i added a fan onto the back to draw the hot ari out of it and the ari is sucked into it through a bunch of slats down by the bottom, so there is fairly good airflow. there isnt really a way to add volts to it really because it runs on power from the AGP port alone. not an additional plug. anyway thanks for all the help.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 03:15 AM
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I wouldn't worry about hurting an SE...not a big price to replace, but if you want to be safe, lower it too 420MHz, and it should be fine.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 05:28 AM
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why dont u all go buy water cooled pelts and stop ur crying! =- )

my 6800 runs around 59 idle, and on up it to load its 72 was highest I've seen. Too warm for me, I'm considering (water)cooling options, but there aren't many Nvidias like to trottle a lot too. Which I think causes less heat(i know ) so Nvidia really would be hard to hit the top limit. I've read ATi's emails on websites regarding people's emails about hot x800's, they said the card will be safe to 120ish and fine at 100 for a while, real heaters!
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Old 7th September, 2004, 11:28 AM
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Just as a really general rule, once the silicon hits ~125C nasty things start to happen. When chips are made, a process called 'doping' adds some impurities to the silicon to alter how it conducts. This process is highly controlled, and the impurities are what makes the chip work! At around 125C, the silicon is hot enough for the impurities to start to "migrate", or slowly diffuse into other areas. The end result is that transistors become short circuits, and the chip no longer works. This is a non-reversable change, so is best avoided!

Some types of doping appear to be more sensitive to temperature than others. This is generally what determines the maximum temperature before damage occurs.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattthegamer463
ok thanks alot. but when i say fry i mean damage it by pushing it too hard.
My computer is built in a drawer, so my ventalation sucks. I have pushed my card so hard that the heat builds up then after a few hours of 3D gaming the card would lock up. Touching the HSF would result in slightly burnt finger tips. Yet after a reboot and some cool down time the card was always fine. I killed it while adding extra cooling to it.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mattthegamer463
.... there isnt really a way to add volts to it really because it runs on power from the AGP port alone. not an additional plug. anyway thanks for all the help.
If you want something bad enough, there's always a way.
Overvolting graphics cards is not that difficult. If you look around, there are a few different methods, usually specific to certain cards. However, I don't do it myself because of obvious risks.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 03:40 PM
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My X800Pro turned XT PE never goes above 65. Idles at ~35
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Old 7th September, 2004, 04:23 PM
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My temps seem to be droping, dont know if its the thermal paste breaking in?
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Old 7th September, 2004, 06:17 PM
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the 9600 i sold to SteveI went to 460 on stock (no fan) cooling. no artifacts. I upgraded the cooling to ensure the survival of the card, and never gave it extra voltage. never needed it. It was an awesome card, and i would have not sold it, except for buying a handful od 9800pro's for a decent price, which left the card collecting dust.
AFAIK, overclocking a gpu without giving it extra voltage won't harm the chip, it'll just produce artifacts. i never recommend pushing a card to artifacting for more than a second or so, just to be safe.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staz
My computer is built in a drawer, so my ventalation sucks. I have pushed my card so hard that the heat builds up then after a few hours of 3D gaming the card would lock up. Touching the HSF would result in slightly burnt finger tips. Yet after a reboot and some cool down time the card was always fine. I killed it while adding extra cooling to it.

lockups happen LOOOOOONG before permanant damage takes place. if you use VPU recover, you should never have a problem that will permanently damage your card, as long as you never increase the AGP voltage
although agp volts will allow you to run the agp bus at a faster speed, there are very important reasons as to why you never should. In order for that card to display an image proerly, there are alot of timing issues at play, from the actual rendering pipeline to the vertex pipeline, to the memory bus on the card to the memory bus over the agp bridge, to the refresh rate of monitor...they are all set to a predetermined "safe" level for things to go smoothly. people kill thing when overclocking when generally one of these parts, or another one i have not mentioned has been forgotten.

good reading is the ATI SDK, in which, if you can force it through your head, you'll find proper detailing on to how you can tweak the driver to compensate for certain things being pushed out of spec, and keep your hardware safe.

all the temps i posted above for maxe should cause lockups, with the exception of the 420. this gpu tens to go as far as you want it, to the point that i think it may be possible that we see a new revision of this chip coming out first quarter next year. Generally i get these things right too!
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Old 7th September, 2004, 09:16 PM
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what are artifacts anyway? i thought i had a pretty good understanding of them, but now im not sure.
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Old 7th September, 2004, 09:20 PM
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memory artifact appear as slashes on BGA mem and looks like a smashed screen on tsop mem

missing pixels (snow) and misdraw pixels are generally heat or timing errors


IMHO.
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