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Old 11th March, 2002, 10:14 PM
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Leaking pump..

Interesting thing happened today. I started my computers before leaving for work to start cruching/folding. After about 5 minutes full load, i realized I forgot to start the pump. Temps were about 60*C when the realization came. I started the pump, expecting temps to decrease within the next few minutes, but instead they went up! After I hit 65*C, MBM shutdown the rig. I then looked at the bottom of my case and saw the mousepad that the pump sits on was soaked. I was leaking from the bottom of the pump.

I didn't have time to mess with it so I shut the computer off, hung the pump in a bucket and went to work. I don't know what happened, but my theory is this:

Pump was not on, causing water temps to get into the 60s. The additional pressure caused by the hot water started the leak. The only way I can figure why the water didn't cool when I did start the pump, was that possible the pressure got so high that it cause backpressure and impeded the pump from doing its job.

This is the first leak I've seen out of this system, I've had it a month. I'm hoping when I get home the leak will have stopped never to return, but we'll see.

System is a closed system: Pump - Radiator - Waterblock - Pump.



*edit*... almost forgot, I have a "T" fitting to bleed and fill, but its sealed.
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Old 14th March, 2002, 03:39 PM
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Also possible that you've blown a seal: water will expand by 0.013 cc per cc of water in your system for the temperature increase between 20ºC and 60ºC - so for an average system volume of 3 litres you've got an expansion of 39.28cc. As you can imagine, for a closed system, this'll place the system under enormous internal pressure: 398 psi to be exact!

It's for this reason that in a closed system, you should include a small header tank (50cc) which is open to the atmosphere (a small hole in the top is good), and this should be placed at the highest point in the system. This has the additional advantage of making your cooling loop self-bleeding and making it easy to fill. That way, at whatever temperature your system reaches, you won't be dealing w/ system pressures in excess of a few psi head pressure (due to height of the water).
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Old 14th March, 2002, 05:00 PM
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I should've posted earlier...

Thanks for the input Kaitain. Actually I checked the pump when I got home and to my dismay there was a sizeable crack running the length of the pump faceplate where the adapter attaches to the intake. As you point out, the added pressure might have caused this. Fortunately for me, the part is only about 7 bucks, but I have to pay another 7 just to ship it lol.

When all is said and done, not a major disaster. All my components are still intact in the rig, just a KIA pump faceplate which should arrive here on friday. Only down side is I can't crunch SETI for a week, which will hurt the stats lol.
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Old 14th March, 2002, 05:01 PM
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Oh yea, I don't know if you saw this, but I do have a "T" fitting in the system to bleed/fill but I keep it sealed. Perhaps from now on I will leave it open.
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Old 14th March, 2002, 05:10 PM
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DOH!! lloks like you lucked out though... time to wire those pumps up to some relays, eh?? :nervous:
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Old 14th March, 2002, 06:20 PM
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you said it brother!! lol

any hints, links, or sites?
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Old 15th March, 2002, 08:53 AM
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if it's a magdrive pump, it will last longer if you leave in on 24/7, they are only made to start a few time and run forever, so wiring it into a relay is not the best idea.
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Old 15th March, 2002, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kaitain
It's for this reason that in a closed system, you should include a small header tank (50cc) which is open to the atmosphere
I dissagree. When you vent the system the flow rate drops quite a bit.

I have a "pop-off" valve in my rig that blows at 10psi, keeps it all safe, keeps flow rates at 100%, and eliminates the need for an expansion tank(though I have to have a "puke tube"). This is the same type of system used in automotive applications.
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Old 15th March, 2002, 10:52 AM
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Yeah, I'd thought about suggesting pressure-relief valves of some description (the ones at work are balanced against a weighted spring that get's compressed w/in a psi of the set-point - but at about £300 per unit )

The other form of header-tank is a sealed one, which means that at any point, the pressure due to expansion will not exceed 14.5psi. Unfortunately, at this point, the system boils.

dimm- have you had any pump/fan failures that have caused your relief valve to open?
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Old 15th March, 2002, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kaitain
dimm- have you had any pump/fan failures that have caused your relief valve to open?
I had my radiator fan stop due to a loose wire once. My datalogger recorded a water temp of 59C before windows crashed and the load dropped to a point that the radiator could handle it passively.

I actually had to make my relief valve, as I couldn't find one that was suitable. It's just a 1/2" diameter ball bearing sitting in a seat with a rubber O-ring. The ball has a spring on one side calibrated with a SAE 3/16" fine thread bolt. I'm probably going to impove the design by adding a check valve and small catch tank with a submerged hose, that way when the system cools down it can suck the water in the catch tank back in to the coolant loop.
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Old 15th March, 2002, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
I'm probably going to impove the design by adding a check valve and small catch tank with a submerged hose, that way when the system cools down it can suck the water in the catch tank back in to the coolant loop.
sounds sweet, must be done me thinks
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