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CRASHED! A topic for SEVERE and immediate Hardware and Operating System FAILURES. We will try to get you up again. NOT for Optimization questions!


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 28th December, 2001, 05:18 PM
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What do you guys/gals think the prob is?

the rig in question is #4 (see sig).

I decided to make a working machine by scavenging parts. So the rig is as follows:

The rig started life as a Powerspec 1600 pc from microcenter.
The rig is one of those desktop computers (non tower type) that lays flat.

Cyrix 166 chip
mobo = ???
Phoenix bios (very old version)
1 gig Western Digital HD
Mitsumi 2x CD-Rom
cheapo modem

I boot from a windows floppy, get a POST as well as bios. I fdisk and redo the partitions, I also do a fdisk /mbr, then I format. When I reboot, everything is ok. I can access the c: drive and copy and save files, etc.. , so I figure the HD is ok. When I go into bios, the Cd rom drive is detected.

When I try installing the OS is where the probs start. I've tried Win 95, ME, Red hat 6.2, and mandrake 8.0. None have worked.

I tried ME the most because the boot disk should have all Cd Rom drivers needed for the install, where as 95 does not. So I boot using the ME boot disk and select "boot from Cd rom" from the options... I then get an error that says "windows setup files not found", and it goes right to the A: prompt.

My guess is that there is a problem with the Cd rom drivers or that the CD rom is just bad. What do u guys think?

I tried downloading the drivers from the mitsumi site and putting them on the win95 boot disk, but i think I either got the wrong driver or wrote the config.sys line wrong because it tells me that the ATAPI device was not loaded correctly.
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Old 28th December, 2001, 10:10 PM
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When you wish to boot from the Me CD-ROM, is the CD-ROM set as 1st in the boot order in BIOS? Ie: CD-ROM, Floppy, HDD, and maybe SCSI Device?

Btw, I had an 8x Mitsumi CD-ROM that never worked with Mitsumi drivers. I used a driver for Funai CD-ROM's instead.
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Old 28th December, 2001, 10:17 PM
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currently, the boot order is: floppy, CD rom, HD.

Actually I booted from the ME floppy first, it then gives you the option to install ME from a CD rom (option #1), which is what I chose.
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Old 28th December, 2001, 10:40 PM
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A few things to try;

1) Can you try another CD Drive?...or;
2) Can you copy an OS onto your 1ghz HD in a different PC then put that HD in that PC and try installing? [if that don’t work];
3) Memory can cause this type of problem [if it wont install from a HD]

This is what I do to eliminate CD’s etc.

HTH

Dave S
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Old 29th December, 2001, 06:45 AM
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I'm now 90% sure its the CD drive or driver. I put the ME boot disk in and it appears to load the D: device driver. I then put a Cd in a hit >cd D:, that goes ok, then I hit >dir from the D: prompt and I get the Abort, Fail, Retry thing. I'm thinking the CD drive. I'll try replacing it with another.

If that doesn't work, ill try those suggestions you had Dave. Thanks.
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Old 29th December, 2001, 12:34 PM
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally posted by e_storm
I'm now 90% sure its the CD drive or driver. I put the ME boot disk in and it appears to load the D: device driver. I then put a Cd in a hit >cd D:, that goes ok, then I hit >dir from the D: prompt and I get the Abort, Fail, Retry thing. I'm thinking the CD drive. I'll try replacing it with another.

If that doesn't work, ill try those suggestions you had Dave. Thanks.
hey no problem at all i hope it all works out, let me know if you need anymore help

good luck

Dave S
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Old 29th December, 2001, 07:29 PM
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I would definately try another cdrom drive on this system or the drive in another system. Is the drive on the primary channel as a slave or the secondary channel as a master? and what are the jumpers set to on the cdrive are they correct.
I would try the drive in another computer and with a differant ide lead first to see if it is definately the drive that is bad. If it works take another drive you know works and try that on this system with the same and a differant ide lead to see if it's either the board or the lead thats gone.
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Old 29th December, 2001, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Phil
I would definately try another cdrom drive on this system or the drive in another system. Is the drive on the primary channel as a slave or the secondary channel as a master? and what are the jumpers set to on the cdrive are they correct.
I would try the drive in another computer and with a differant ide lead first to see if it is definately the drive that is bad. If it works take another drive you know works and try that on this system with the same and a differant ide lead to see if it's either the board or the lead thats gone.
Cd drive has been tried on both IDE channels. Jumpers are correct or the drive would not be detected in bios. CD rom is alone on the second IDE channel presently and is master.
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Old 29th December, 2001, 08:26 PM
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At the D: prompt when you're at "Abort, Fail, Retry" have ya entered F to see what error msg comes up?
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Old 30th December, 2001, 03:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LutaWicasa
At the D: prompt when you're at "Abort, Fail, Retry" have ya entered F to see what error msg comes up?
I did do that but don't remember what the error message was, I'll try it again and repost.

I never did know why you had a few different options with that.
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Old 9th January, 2002, 06:24 AM
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The oak driver that is on the boot floppy should work with mitsumi drives.

I'm gonna go another direction with this. Boot it up with the case open. Tell me how hot that heatsink is getting. Cyrix chips have exhibited problems like this for me in the past. The heat doesn't actually crash them, just makes them stupid. (My single remaining cyrix processor is part of a wind chime now (MII 300).


I'd still try another CD drive, though.
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Old 9th January, 2002, 02:52 PM
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Oops, I never did repost about the "F" error message because I decided to just get a new CD Rom drive and see if it works... I'm still looking for a cheapie drive.

Azriel, I know what you mean about the heat... when this was a working computer (3 years ago lol) I would get strange error messages and other strange things would happen when I would run the computer too long in a warm room.

I'm gonna give a shot to replacing the Cd drive, then I'll see how hot it gets. I'd tend not to think heat is the culprit because the computer is not running for more than a few minutes when I'm testing it.
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Old 13th January, 2002, 10:31 PM
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at this point you have nothing to losde by taking off the top and bottom of the cd drive.it has 2 metal rails that the head slides on with plastic gears that drive it.there is probably dust or debris on the gears keeping the head from moving or sometimes they just get stuck.you'll see right away if its not fully in the foward position.this is where it picks up the autorun.run it back and forth gently with yor fingers and reset it at the outside edge.reassemble and more than likely it will work.
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Old 14th January, 2002, 07:31 PM
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I doubt this will solve it, but it's worth a try....u can get a generic boot disc based on windows 98, but it has worked for me for all OS's....just go to the following link, I have never had problems with it, so good luck

http://www.topqualityfreeware.com/~j...s/wbootess.exe
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Old 14th January, 2002, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by CNUCompGuy
I doubt this will solve it, but it's worth a try....u can get a generic boot disc based on windows 98, but it has worked for me for all OS's....just go to the following link, I have never had problems with it, so good luck

http://www.topqualityfreeware.com/~j...s/wbootess.exe
So, this boot disk has all necessary device drivers, including CD rom?
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Old 14th January, 2002, 10:32 PM
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correct e_storm, it has all of the necessary drivers, I have installed several Windows OS's using this disk, basically download the file, then run it and put a floppy in the drive and it will prompt u, thn it will create it for you, no problems for ya what-so-ever, and if you need any other type of boot-disk/utility disk, just go to www.bootdisk.com and look around, it's a nifty site that I've been using for a few years, now....anyways, good luck, ttyl
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Old 16th January, 2002, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by CNUCompGuy
correct e_storm, it has all of the necessary drivers, I have installed several Windows OS's using this disk, basically download the file, then run it and put a floppy in the drive and it will prompt u, thn it will create it for you, no problems for ya what-so-ever, and if you need any other type of boot-disk/utility disk, just go to www.bootdisk.com and look around, it's a nifty site that I've been using for a few years, now....anyways, good luck, ttyl
Actually, I am familiar with these generic boot disks. I have one of these already, but it doesn't have CD rom device drivers on it (its a Dos boot disk). Thanks for the link, this should be very helpful in the future.

In my case of this particular Cd Rom drive, I tried booting using the boot disk for Win ME already, which has all necessary cd rom device drivers on it and it didn't work. I got to the e: prompt fine (I figure that to mean that the device driver was installed fine), but once i hit >dir, I get the Abort, Fail, Retry error (I figure that to mean that it cannot read any files on the e: drive, ie. drive problems).
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Old 16th January, 2002, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by e_storm
In my case of this particular Cd Rom drive, I tried booting using the boot disk for Win ME already, which has all necessary cd rom device drivers on it and it didn't work. I got to the e: prompt fine (I figure that to mean that the device driver was installed fine), but once i hit >dir, I get the Abort, Fail, Retry error (I figure that to mean that it cannot read any files on the e: drive, ie. drive problems).
From memory, the Win98/ME boot disk has a handful of drivers for CD-ROMs on it. It supports ATAPI complient CD-ROM drives, and CD-ROM drives on a limited number of SCSI cards. In fact, even the Win95 boot disk has support for ATAPI complient CD-ROM drives.

If your CD-ROM drive is not fully ATAPI complient, then the OAK driver will not be able to drive it properly. I know that some of the earlier IDE drives didn't quite manage ATAPI complience. From memory, the OAK driver is the only driver that supports the IDE interface. All other drivers on the disk are either propriatory or ASPI.

I've never had a win98/ME boot disk actually work for me without some work done to the boot disk. I guess that's because I don't use Adaptec SCSI cards, as there's better and cheaper out there.

The real solution: Try a different CD-ROM drive.

AidanII
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Old 16th January, 2002, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by AidanII

The real solution: Try a different CD-ROM drive.

AidanII
One step ahead of you brother...should be here by early next week.

Thats all good information to know about the Oak drivers and such, thanks
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Old 16th January, 2002, 08:46 PM
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yet, if that doesn't work, which I'm sure it will, try either ur old or new CD-ROM on the primary IDE port, ur second could be bad, but just a suggestion since it's happened to me before....also, u might wanna try using another IDE cable, I've also had that problem b4, but then again, chances r that it is the CD-ROM, ttyl....and ur welcome for supplying u guys with that site, ttyl
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