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EPoX MotherBoards EPoX Intel and AMD Motherboards.


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 07:36 AM
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Exclamation Help Me Beat My Friend

I just finished building my computer and its running great.
My friend just went out and bought one for the same price it crushes me (particularly in mem scores)....check it out


Mine------------------------------His

Epox 8rda-------------------------Asus PT800
XP 1800+ 'A' @ 1.93 (183x10.5)----Stock P4 2.4 (800mhz fsb)
Samsung PC3200 DDR - 512mb-----Kingston PC3200 DDR - 512mb
7-3-3-2.5-------------------------(stock)
60g Barracuda ATA IV--------------same
GF4 ti4200 (getting a 4400 soon)---GF4 FX 5200

PCMARK SCORES

CPU:5863 --- 6100
MEM: 5113 --- 6900
HD: 862 --- 1010

------------------
what do you reckon I should do - got about 200 hundred to spend?
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 07:50 AM
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He will naturally beat you in memory scores on a Pentium 4 platform where there is more bus bandwidth available. You will never see those kind of scores with Athlon 32 bit processor.
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Old 11th July, 2003, 08:09 AM
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thats not what I want to hear! Think positive - theres got to be a reason why everyone likes Athlon (or did I choose the wrong company)
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Old 11th July, 2003, 08:12 AM
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Have you tried running 3DMark2001SE330 ?
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 08:43 AM
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nope - never heard of it??? I have 2003
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 08:57 AM
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Ignore memory benchmarks. Compare using programs that you actually use, eg. your favourite games, etc.

There's a review on HardOCP that shows a PT800 getting whalloped by an i875 in memory benchmarks. But when it comes to real world programs they're within error margin of being a tie.

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDk1LDI=

With the HD, you can try disabling AAM, if it's enabled. Search the Seagate website for more info.
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CPU: T'bred 1700 JIUHB 0302 @ 10.5x200, 1.8V
CPU HSF: Volcano 7+
Motherboard: Epox 8RDA+ R1.1 @ 1.8V (750 ohm) cooled by stock AMD HSF
RAM: 2x Corsair CMX512-3200C2 @ 2-2-3-11 sync, 2.77V
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Old 11th July, 2003, 09:27 AM
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buy a big ph@ storage switch and kick his ass at load time :)
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Old 11th July, 2003, 11:22 AM
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point takin

"Ignore memory benchmarks. Compare using programs that you actually use, eg. your favourite games, etc. "

can't find anything on AAM @ seagate.....don't really care about loading time (i never turn my computer off)
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Old 11th July, 2003, 11:25 AM
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i was reffering more to game load times, but nevermind :)

use an older game like quake2, that has no sse2 optimisations and you'll smoke his framerates :P
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Thoroughbred 2400+ @ 2300Mhz, Abit NF7 2.0, 1536Mb Samsung PC2700 (DDR433)
LSI 20160 Ultra SCSI 3 HBA, 1xMaxtor Atlas 10K IV 36GB w/ 8mb cache
3ware Escalade 6410 Storage Switch, Unit 0: [RAID 10] 4x120Gb IBM 7K250 w/ 8mb cache (64K Stripe)
3Com 3CR990SVR97 Server NIC, DMX 6fire 24/96 LT, Hercules Radeon 9800Pro
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Angels fall farthest...

Last edited by Flak; 11th July, 2003 at 01:23 PM.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jutboy
I just finished building my computer and its running great.
My friend just went out and bought one for the same price it crushes me (particularly in mem scores)....check it out
Cannot be at least from what I know. xp 1800+ definitely costs less than p2.4c, and the same should apply to epox 8rda vs asus p4c800.

But basically you have to admit, a pentium 800 fsb system will crush yours in just about every benchmark, especially if you are below 200 fsb because your friend has both the fsb bandwidth and the raw cpu mhz advantage.

But what matters most, is the real world performance, and there your system should perform better than in benchmark comparison. Try to compare fps of some games where the overall performance of the system matters, not cpu specs or whatever.
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Epox 8RDA3+ v1.1, 3827 bios, 1.6v Vdd, stock cooling on nb, sb
XP Barton 2500+ @ 200x11 = 2200 mhz, 1.725v Vcore
2x256 Mushkin pc3500 Black Level1 @ dc sync, 2-2-3-8, 2.63 Vdimm
Sapphire Radeon 9600 Pro @ stock
WDC HDD 80 gig, 7200rpm, 8 mb cache
WDC HDD 20 gig, 7200rpm, 2 mb cache
300 W noname psu & case one side open, no other cooling
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 02:12 PM
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inform your friend that his p4 is an overclocking dream that he should be able to take it upto 3Ghz with little effort then sit back and watch yours get whooped even further.

I dont see how you can expect yours to be faster as even on amd's pr ratings you dont keep up (2400+ = 2Ghz amd clock). Amd needid a new core a long time ago, intel were slated for reusing the same style design for too long and well amd have done the same thing more so. The athlon core is now 4 years + old, yes its evolved alot but its still fundamentally the same.

Hard luck m8 he made the superior choice

K

P.S real world performance ? the p4 is superiorer in that too, quake 3 is getting on for 100fps different between the p4 3.2 and the xp3200+ the 875/865 are by far the superior chipset currently, if anything when total system power is needid amd setups fall further behind
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 02:17 PM
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hmm, suck my shorter, packetswitch favouring pipelines is all i have to say to that :)
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Thoroughbred 2400+ @ 2300Mhz, Abit NF7 2.0, 1536Mb Samsung PC2700 (DDR433)
LSI 20160 Ultra SCSI 3 HBA, 1xMaxtor Atlas 10K IV 36GB w/ 8mb cache
3ware Escalade 6410 Storage Switch, Unit 0: [RAID 10] 4x120Gb IBM 7K250 w/ 8mb cache (64K Stripe)
3Com 3CR990SVR97 Server NIC, DMX 6fire 24/96 LT, Hercules Radeon 9800Pro
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Angels fall farthest...
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Old 11th July, 2003, 03:11 PM
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jutboy,
looking at your specs, your machine should have cost hundreds less to build... The CPU alone is 100 less, the mobo, another 50. As such, You should not be attempting to match peformance of a much more expensive machine. But there are things you could look at...

First, is the mobo's FSB max'd out? You can lower the multiplier, and try to go higher. Some people have gotten to 200fsb w/o voltmods. This will help your mem bandwidth a lot, but still will fall short.

If memory benchmarks scores are really that important to you.... A P4 is the right choice...

However, it is a subjective decision... I'll give up a few hundred points to save a boatload of money, and the AXPs today have many advantages that more than make up for the lower memory bandwidth. The CPUs are more efficient and do much more work in the same cycle. To me, P4s are a rip off to the entire industry, based solely on marketing hype. It is a 1 trick pony. That the industry considers it a leading tech, really hurts the industry in the long run. (Just my opinion).

To anyone who would argue with me about the merits of a P4.... I choose to build machines for my entire family to enjoy, and I get more value from having 4 very fast machines being in my house being used very frequently, than being able to afford 2 machines of similar performance. (Unfortunately, I'm the only one in my house that even knows how to run memory benchmarks, so no one else would be impressed.)

EDIT: one final point... I have more than 4 boxes. the rest fold... 'nuf said.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jutboy
Mine------------------------------His

Epox 8rda-------------------------Asus PT800
XP 1800+ 'A' @ 1.93 (183x10.5)----Stock P4 2.4 (800mhz fsb)
Samsung PC3200 DDR - 512mb-----Kingston PC3200 DDR - 512mb
7-3-3-2.5-------------------------(stock)
60g Barracuda ATA IV--------------same
GF4 ti4200 (getting a 4400 soon)---GF4 FX 5200

?
Well as said beforce your motherboard and cpu (cpu especially) are far cheaper than this. If you reach 2ghz with maybe a slightly higher fsb you could equal his proccesor although you wont equal his memory bandwidth.

Your computer however in many cases should run games better. The GF4 ti 4200 beats the GFFX 5200. To test this you could ask your friend to run 3d mark 01 (available form www.futuremark.com) or UT2003's benchmarks.

3d mark 03 probably will show your computer in the lead but im unsure as the FX 5200 can run an extra test due to it being dx9 hardware. (yu should be able to run the other 3 tests faster)
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Old 11th July, 2003, 05:26 PM
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upgrade your processor... barton cores rock.. for oc'ing .. can't beat the 2500+ barton....
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 06:24 PM
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Yeah I say buy a 2500+ and you'll still have 100 bucks left. I run mine at 197x11 no prob. If I had a volt mod I'd push on. If I can get my hands on a rev 2 I'm gonna be all over it. If your overclocking the 4200 now then a 4400 is not gonna help you much.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 06:51 PM
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also u should do a VDD mod and buy some NB and SB cooling
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 09:59 PM
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Your 3d performance should be higher than his as your gaphics card is faster, plus those cards tend to overclock very nicely...

I recon you can also beat him in pcmark CPU as well with a better CPU clock and tighter memory timings.

Pure memory bandwith battle is lost, but you should also beat him in number crunching benches such as superPI where XP has an advantage over P4.
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Best of luck in the future all my friends.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 10:21 PM
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lol why are you american peeps always so "competative"...
Anyways, you won't beat him in PCmark (which is often called P4mark...) but that is completely irrelevant, just like sandra and all the other synthetic benches.
Basically 3dmark is a pointless benchmark, too, but if you're looking for a bench where you can beat him then use gaming benches for your vidcard is much faster - and like Holst said it should overclock nicely, too.
YOur machine should also be faster when it comes to SuperPi, Seti@Home or Folding@Home...
However, when he starts clocking his P4 to 3Ghz or so (which won't be a problem even with default Vcore and stock HSF) you lose in any cpu bench.
Get yourself a Barton 2500+ and pray to get a nice one, thats what you can do if you really wanna beat him (for whatever reason).
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2003, 10:23 PM
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look who's competeing now..
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