Problem: Epox 8K7A - Please help!

[anthonyv]

Hi there,

I'm a graphic/web developer and rely on my system for my work.
i was recently given a pc, configured as detailed in the system report i have attached to this post.

The system tends to restart generally when i use memory hungry programs, eg, photoshop, games, etc, though it also restarts randomly during general usage, eg surfing the net.

i thought the problem may have been the hard disk, so i reformatted, had the same problem. i tried a new hdd, still had same problem.

then i tried changing the RAM, still same problem.

Also tried removing/changing graphics card, still had no luck.

I don't know what more the problem could be, as i'm not too good on the hardware side of things, and the system was built by someone.

i've been told there are some settings i could change to do with power and thats likely to be the source of the problem, but i am not sure where these are?

the system was tweaked, something to do with "10.5x....?" of that means anything?

would be very grateful if anyone could advise me on how i could fix the problem?
i am aware i haven't given too much detail here, so if more is needed please advise and i will provide.

also when the system restarts there's always a QUICK flick of the blue screen of death as it restarts.
sometimes when it restarts, when it gets to the point where the syste, would load the windows login screen, it would flick blue screen and restart again, sometimes looping this process 3 or 4 times before it actually loads the windows screen and is ok.

i would love to undo any overclocking thats been done to my system by the builder? - its all hardware based - nothing within windows or 3rd party software etc. only hardware and bios i'm assuming.

Please find attached to this post, a detailed system report provided by Sandra 2005 software. i think this my help!

thanks in advance for any help.

Anthony.

[Logan]

Have you tried a new power supply? I don't know but it's been my experience that EPoX boards are pretty finicky when it comes to their power. Find a good stable PSU and throw in that puppy. Keep in mind that you don't need one that will power a car, you just need one that keeps pretty stable voltages.

Try this. It's the user manual for your board.

[anthonyv]

thanks for that, i spoke to the guy who built the system, apparantly the power supply in there is a very good one, and doesn't need replacing.

A Qtek 550?

thanks for the advice of possibility though.

[Gizmo]

In looking at your system report, the first thing I see that catches my eye is that your CPU is running almost 35C above ambient. If this is a normal idle temp for your CPU, it is TOO HOT (61C)!

First things first. Pop the case open and check to make sure that the fan on the CPU heat sink is running. Also make sure that the heat sink and fan are not clogged with any kind of dust bunnies or other gunk.

[cadaveca]

Memory Module 1
Type 512MB DDR-SDRAM
Technology16x(32Mx8)
SpeedPC3200U 2.5-3-3-8
Date of Manufacture25 December 1999
Set Timing @ 200MHz2.5-3-3-8
Memory Module 2
Type512MB DDR-SDRAM
Technology16x(32Mx8)
SpeedPC3200U 2.5-3-3-8
Date of Manufacture25 December 1999
Set Timing @ 200MHz2.5-3-3-8




this might be your problem. memeory is pc3200, set at pc 2100 speeds. other than that, everything from the sandra report is normal. CPU temp is way high too, if that is idle.60c idle equates to about 75c under load...ouch.

[anthonyv]

thanks gizmo, checked for dust on fan, thats all clear, and fan is running smooth...

as for CPU temp and memory problem, what changes do i make and where, to fix this?

[Gizmo]

You'll have to change the FSB timing in the BIOS. Since I'm not familiar with that BIOS and board, I've really no idea where to tell you to look, except that there should be something in the BIOS like 'Memory Settings' or 'Memory Timings' or something of that nature, and one of them should be something like 'FSB Frequency'.

I'd also suggest checking that there is enough heat sink compound between the CPU and the heat sink, but you don't sound like you have enough knowledge to be able to tackle that one without risking damage to your computer. Do you have access to someone with a little more expertise who would be willing to help you out?

[cadaveca]

It could be something as simple as the heat from your CPU heats the chipset on the motherboard too much under laod, and causes the reboots. what sort of heatsink is on the motherboard, other than the cpu heatsink?

[anthonyv]

not really, the guy who built the system lives on the other side of the country, this being my problem.

appreciate all your help tho. will try the bios settings now...

[anthonyv]

well there's one on the graphics card, and there's the main systen fan, aswell as two extra fans modded into the top of the system case (though these are disconnected at present)

[anthonyv]

here are some pictures i just took of the inside of the system...

[anthonyv]

Originally Posted by gizmo

You'll have to change the FSB timing in the BIOS. Since I'm not familiar with that BIOS and board, I've really no idea where to tell you to look, except that there should be something in the BIOS like 'Memory Settings' or 'Memory Timings' or something of that nature, and one of them should be something like 'FSB Frequency'.

I'd also suggest checking that there is enough heat sink compound between the CPU and the heat sink, but you don't sound like you have enough knowledge to be able to tackle that one without risking damage to your computer. Do you have access to someone with a little more expertise who would be willing to help you out?

just gonna try that

[cadaveca]

dude...you gotta clean that heatsink..it's filthy.

[anthonyv]

ohh! ok will do that.

here are some shots of bios settings to do with memory..
do i need to make changes here?

[cadaveca]

i would leave it on auto, myself for your system.

seriously, i think it's just heat that is causing all of your issues. Like was said earlier, 60c idle is way too hot. Like whoa....yes, that hot.

get a can of compressed air, and blow that puppy out. Make sure to use short bursts. If after cleaning out everything, the pc still reboots, chances are you have some sort of hardware failure.

Nothing in your system is overclocked, as far as i can tell. Your memory is underclocked, to match inline with your cpu speed.

[anthonyv]

ok, i've just been down the road and bought a can of compressed air, cleaned the dust (didn't realise there was so much hidden away) out of the motherboard, cpu, fans, etc. loads removed...shocked me.

anyways, i've created another report using the software and attached the update to this post...notice the temperature has changed...

i haven't had a problem qith the restarts as of yet, but these are random.. i will launch photoshop and get some heavy graphic content going, see if it does its usual at that point.

Nothing in your system is overclocked, as far as i can tell. Your memory is underclocked, to match inline with your cpu speed.

how do i go about changing this so that its inline with the cpu?

one again, really appreciate all the help i'm receiving here.

[cadaveca]

According to the first Sandra report, your memory is 200mhz/400mhz DDR, and is currently set to 133mhz. There should be an option there to change that, but because your motherboard is quite old, there is chance that it does not support memory speeds faster that what it already is.


You could try running the "Folding@Home" client, as it is quite cpu and memory intensive, and it will heat your system up quite a bit. Generally speaking, if it lasts through 48 hours of folding, it's stable, but there are exceptions to every rule, of course.

[MietmaN]

Originally Posted by cadaveca

According to the first Sandra report, your memory is 200mhz/400mhz DDR, and is currently set to 133mhz. There should be an option there to change that, but because your motherboard is quite old, there is chance that it does not support memory speeds faster that what it already is.

Apart from that the memory is running in synchro mode with the CPU's FSB, so he wouldn't get any noticeable performace increase, although VIA chipsets are more "asynchro friendly" than those of nVidia. As already said by others : nothing seems to be overclocked and I would leave everything as it is.

This is the real killer and power consumer :

AMD Athlon(tm) processor
Speed 1.40GHz
Model Number 1396 (estimated)
Performance Rating PR1857 (estimated)
Type Standard
Package Socket A PGA
Multiplier 21/2x
Generation G7
Name Athlon M4 (Thunderbird) 180nm 650-1.4GHz 1.7-1.8V
Revision/Stepping 4 / 4 (0)
Stepping Mask A9
Core Voltage Rating 1.750V

If the temperature measurement is taken form the socket and this seems to be very probable, than those 60C are much more in reality. I share your opinion about the system's overheating (still, after cleaning).

You could try running the "Folding@Home" client, as it is quite cpu and memory intensive, and it will heat your system up quite a bit. Generally speaking, if it lasts through 48 hours of folding, it's stable, but there are exceptions to every rule, of course.

Adobe Photoshop does the same, if not even better - graphic's reendering stresses almost all components and reveals all instabilities even better than Prime, Folding@Home and other similar stuff (checked on an Intel based system by a friend of mine).

My suggestion : changing the cooler to some solid copper one with some good thermal compound (Arctic Silver V or Cooler Master Premium) should solve the current problems.

[anthonyv]

ok, take a look at the updated report, i thinkthere are some changes to the temperature after allt he cleaning i did.
i've just run photoshop with some heavy graphic material and it didn't restart... looks good so far!

as for

According to the first Sandra report, your memory is 200mhz/400mhz DDR, and is currently set to 133mhz. There should be an option there to change that, but because your motherboard is quite old, there is chance that it does not support memory speeds faster that what it already is.

in the screenshot of my bios above, where you see the memory setting on 133, should i change that? and what to? - this is for "CPU Clock" though, so where would i be likely to find the memory settings for this?

the motherboard has some switches on it, which allow you to mess about with multipliers? - eg 10.5x133 i think... is that what i need?
and what multiplier would it be... having checked out the manual, there are settings for a range of multipliers. at the moment it's on default/auto.

sorry for all the questions guys!

[MietmaN]

Originally Posted by anthonyv

ok, take a look at the updated report, i thinkthere are some changes to the temperature after allt he cleaning i did.
i've just run photoshop with some heavy graphic material and it didn't restart... looks good so far!

Please, that second report of yours is a real browser killer, at least for my notebook I'm using at the moment (12MB HTML file), but I've somehow managed to get the most important information out of it :

Chipset 1
Model Advanced Micro Devices (AMD) AMD-761 CPU to PCI Bridge
Front Side Bus Speed 2x 133MHz (266MHz data rate)
Total Memory 1GB DDR-SDRAM
Memory Bus Speed 2x 133MHz (266MHz data rate)

Step by step :

1) Your CPU front side bus and your memory front side bus are running now in synchro mode (the same frequency, as listed above), which is the most efficient setting you could have.

2) Your CPU frequency is : current FSB (133MHz) x multiplier you've already mentioned (10.5 in your case). 10.5 x 133MHz gives us 1.4GHz - this is your CPU's current speed (see my previous post and the info from your report).

3) Nothing seems to be overclocked in your system - the problem was the excess heat due to loads of dust (I suspect the thermal compound between your CPU cooler and the CPU, but you can't change it by yourself, can you? ).

4) Since nothing is overclocked and your PC seems to be stable and working properly you don't have to change anything, do you? Including the multiplier, unless you want to : either overclock (I wouldn't recommend this without proper CPU cooling) or underclock (what for? your system is stable!).

5) I'm gonna have a look at the screenshots again