New build, but which one?

[Lazgoat]

Ok, I'm building a rig for a friend. Its primarily going to be used for storing digital camera pics and video, web surfing, email, Word excel etc, nothing too demanding.

I've speced up two different SoA systems to fit his budget (didn't go Intel or A64 due to costs), one based on a Shuttle SN41Gv V3 and the other on an EP8RDA6+ Pro. Both rigs will have an XP2500+ cpu, 512M RAM, 160GB HDD's, 17" Viewsonic TFT, Win XP Home,cordless keyboard & mouse, 16X DVD-RW and Radeon 9550 AGP card for the Epox.. The price difference is almost negligible, £20 in favour of the Shuttle.

I've never used a shuttle, let alone build one up. Are there any issues I need to know about? Which will offer the best performance?

I think he'll go for the Shuttle for minimalistic looks and cost!

Let me know what you think/what you know!

[Got EpOx]

Shuttles offer nice minimalistic effects to the home. But they do also have problems with heat, they are small, so you can't easily expand them or install big graphics cards. Heat is a major problem because the shuttle has a confined space inside it, so a big fan is needed to keep it cool. Building a system inside a large ATX case will ofcourse keep the air flowing nicer than a shuttle, and you can upgrade the system much more easily this way.

[MONKEYMAN]

If its not being used for any heavy gameing/overclocking then go with the shuttle, it small and looks cool, you say the shuttle is a litle cheaper so it might be worth spending a little bit more and putting a xp2500-m in there to keep the temps down a bit.

[Got EpOx]

Yeah if you have some spare cash go for a faster Athlon XP.

[MONKEYMAN]

depends on what air circulation is like in the case(cabling fans etc). he might wanna stick with an xp-m, with lower core voltage it produces less heat and will still be good for the uses listed

[cloasters]

If you buy an LCD monitor, it requires the effort to BS yourself into thinking that its picture is as good as a CRT.

You could save some money if you buy a a CRT monitor, and have it to upgrade to a better processor or have more RAM.

[Rondog]

Why do people always say this?

I have no problems with my LCD.

[Áedán]

Personally, if the system isn't going to be used for gaming, then the Shuttle may well be a better solution - it's smaller and neater, which is something that a lot of people like. As far as overheating goes, I've not had any issues either of my shuttles, and they're shoved down the back of the TV stand!

I'm not sure what cloasters means with his LCD comment - I've had no issues with LCD monitors.

[danrok]

The only annoyance I can have with my LCD compared to my CRT is when working with colour. For example RGB 255,0,0 is identical in appearance to 254,0,0 on my LCD, but I can see the difference on a good CRT.

It's a fairly minor gripe which most people won't notice.

I'd agree that using a mobile CPU in a shuttle is a good idea, to minimise heat.

[Got EpOx]

If the user is only going to use the computer for minor tasks then you should full well go for the shuttle option. An Athlon mobile processor will without a doubt be able to withstand tasks as you mentioned earlier in the thread, probably even some good games such as Half Life 2.

[Lazgoat]

Thanks for the comments I ordered the Shuttle last week and should have it all on Tuesday. To keep things within his budget I had to go for a Sempron 2500+. Not my first choice but the budget was tight and this was about £15 cheaper than an XP-M 2500+ that I wanted to fit.

The minimalist look and space saving features of the Shuttle and LCD are crucial so there was no compromising on gettng a cheaper CRT monitor. For those interested Ebuyer has the Samsung 710M for a VERY reasonble price.

[cloasters]

Maybe you need to be an olde pharte to see the diference in picture quality between LCD and CRT monitors? In a side by side comparison CRT's win every time. The only reason I switched to LCD's is that large CRT's are too heavy to move safely by myself 'cause I'm way out of shape.

[GrahamGarside]

A crt wins on image quality every time, I own an iiyama vision master 454 and it's image quality is wel above any LCD I've seen but the weight and size is a pain. It's weighs about 25-30kg which isn't too heavy, but the size and shape of it make it difficult to carry up stairs and to get into a car for transport

[danrok]

No matter what we think, I'm sure this is the beginning of the end for the CRT.

Those who buy monitors in large quantities and sell them are bound to be biased towards the LCD because they take up less space on ships, lorries and in warehouses. It costs less money to transport them and they are easier to handle.

[Lazgoat]

And for those on a tight budget they are quite good value if you look about .

[Got EpOx]

I love CRT's they have superb image quality and give your computer that 'retro' look.

[GrahamGarside]

It is really annoying that you are charged more for LCD's with a dvi input. You would think a dvi only screen would be the budget option, not a vga only

[Got EpOx]

You'd think so, but no.

[aghastpumpkin]

Have fun Lazgoat. I have a Shuttle SK41. I have had mixed experiences but am now having a lot of problems. Despite it's cute looks and innovation, there are some clear flaws.
Firstly, cooling. Don't be fooled by the anagram I.C.E. What especially suffers is the memory sticks, which awkwardy sit under the hard drive. They are covered over the top by IDE and power cables. Therefore air flow is absolutely rubbish, and the system sometimes gets unstable.
What also gets affected is the HDD. I wouldn't stick a raptor in a Shuttle. My poor Barracuda gets so hot I have scalded my fingers badly touching it after a 2 hour C&C Generals game. The same scorching happens if I touch the memory heatsink.

A second flaw is the power supply. I have read experiences from lots of other Shuttle suers and know I am not alone. The power supply also suffers from very bad cooling. They have not exactly thrilling power ratings and even with the basic components you may find yourself searching for power splitters.
Thirdly, mess. The inside of a Shuttle is so chocabloc with cables, heatsinks, drives or whatever that working on one can be extremely stressful. It's no wonder they get so hot.
I really don't mean to put you off. But as a long term Shuttle user, I am highlighting some of the issues that you and your friend may encounter.
I hope this serves as useful help and not criticism. Unfortunately, I myself have made the decision to not use Shuttle again.
I love their cute looks, they are also very innovative and great for Lan parties. I just can't make up for the flaws.
Naturally, your model is probably different so not all may apply.

[keithwalton]

Any lcd monitor that takes dvi also takes vga, because of this the controller has to be able to process both types of signal so ends up abit more expensive.
As for image quality, take a look at the new breed of lcd's. My samsung 913n is superb. Yes resolution is only 1280x1024. Its a good 8ms panel (thw tested the response to be stable and low across the entire colour band) so blurring is as good as non existant. It also alot brighter than crts (300cd/m^2) higher contrast ratio (700:1)
I've put my monitor alongside a iiyama vision master pro 454 (~£300 odd crt when he bought it a couple of years ago) driven by the secondary output on my monitor and put into clone screen mode.
The difference was clear and in favour of the lcd!
It was clearer, brighter, and sharper not to mention being 100% flat to the edges with no lines on screen and auto adjustment meaning the picture fills the screen perfectly at the touch of a button (no fiddling around for minutes aligning the picture each time you change resolution)
Now comes the crunch my lcd was £220 (can now be got for £200) weighs alot less, costs less, uses less power has a larger screen area and to me is alot nicer to use.
I was skeptical about lcd monitors before and allways recomending people to get crt's because of what i'd heard. Since i got to play with one upfront in a shop i was imediatly converted

Edit - Thats the monitor i put it next to http://www.iiyama.co.uk/pages/conten...=236&PROD=2248
still £215+vat so more expensive than the lcd