AOA Forums AOA Forums AOA Forums Folding For Team 45 AOA Files Home Front Page Become an AOA Subscriber! UserCP Calendar Memberlist FAQ Search Forum Home


Go Back   AOA Forums > Hardware > Graphics and Sound cards; Speakers and other Peripherals


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10th July, 2007, 03:41 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

Recommend a RAID controller

To all those more knowledgeable and experienced than I; I wish to build a RAID array, using four (4) Seagate 320GB 7200.10 HDDs. I am looking for a hardware RAID controller that uses a PCI Express x1 expansion slot. Of course, performance is first priority, but price is also a major consideration.

Could someone make a couple of recommendations for comparison?
__________________

Last edited by Arctucas; 10th July, 2007 at 03:43 PM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 10th July, 2007, 04:14 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

The only SATA RAID controllers I can find that will support 4 drives are PCI-e x4. 3Ware makes a 2-drive controller that fits in a PCI-e x1 slot. In theory, you should be able to plug an x4 card into an x1 slot, but I'd check before you try.

That said, I've not got any experience with the 3Ware SATA controllers, but I've heard that they are quite good, and they are priced competitively.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11th July, 2007, 09:49 AM
Chief Systems Administrator
 
Join Date: September 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 13,075

The aggregate data transfer rate of the four drives (~261Mb/sec) you have chosen is higher than the real world maximum of a PCI express x1 slot (~215Mb/sec).
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12th July, 2007, 06:48 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

I found this; http://www.allstarshop.com/shop/prod...SHJ2L7WH3SF9FF,
which seems like it would be perfect. Any comments on the quality of this unit? I apologize if I seem like a noob, but RAID arrays and controllers are actually new to me.
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12th July, 2007, 07:24 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

It doesn't have any cache memory on it, but as Áedán points out, you're already taking a hit for performance due to the fact that your 4 drives are capable of sustained throughput (in a RAID 0, or 5 configuration) in excess of what you can shove across the x1 slot anyway, so the lack of cache memory probably won't make that much difference.

Other than that, my last experience with Highpoint RAID controllers was 5 years ago, and wasn't pleasant. I can't speak to the newer models, though; they very well may have cleaned up their act. Best I can suggest is to look at some reviews?
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12th July, 2007, 08:10 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

Check out our Hot Deals topic on the Front Page:

http://www.aoaforums.com/frontpage/c.../view/2838/50/

I've provided some links to some deals for you there. If there is a deal you want to take advantage of, be sure to use the link. That will ensure you get the deal and also help AOA.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 11:55 AM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

Gizmo,

Thanks, but apparently the links you provided are all to web sites that are in my Hosts (MVPS) file, and therefore I would not wish to venture there.

You make two very good points about the lack of cache, and that PCI 1x doesn't have the bandwidth.

So would a PCI-E 8x be so much faster that it would warrant using it (my motherboard only has one, and I was hoping to use it for another card)?
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 01:40 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

The links are to redirect sites for tracking purposes. I can assure that the links are quite benign, however I'd lay money that the reason those sites are in your Hosts file are because of the fact that they ARE redirect sites, and that is one of the tricks that spammers use.

By all means, do what you feel best. I would sooner lose a few dollars in commissions than have you believe that we knowingly caused you harm.

As for the other part, PCI-e 4x would be sufficient for what you are doing. Your drives have a rated maximum sustained transfer rate of 72 MB/s. In a RAID 0 or RAID 5, this would mean a maximum aggregate sustained transfer rate of 288 MB/s. The maximum transfer rate of PCI-e 1x is 250 MB/s.

SATA II has a burst transfer rate of 300 MB/s, so you have a theoretical burst of about 1200 MB/s. However, the smallish caches on the drives (8 or 16 MB depending on the model) means that would only come into play for small accesses, and whether that is an issue really depends on what kind of data access patterns you have.

Since I suspect you are going to be doing mostly small bursts of data rather than large sustained transfers (this is the typical pattern for most users), I would expect that the combination of cache plus a wider PCI-e implementation could buy you something in the area of 20% or so performance improvement.

However, that is going to come at a price, the price being a more expensive controller. A PCI-e 4 controller should be sufficient, but you are going to be looking at something in the area of 3 bills or better, I imagine: the 4-port PCI-e 4x SATA 2 9650SE controller from 3Ware that I mentioned earlier is located here and is right at $400 retail, although you should be able to find it for around $350.

Edit: If you want to forgo the cache on the controller, the 4-port PCI-e 4x SATA 2 2240900R controller from Adaptec might be more to your liking at $109.

Last edited by Gizmo; 13th July, 2007 at 01:48 PM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 03:25 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

I've tried formatting the links using javascript instead of HTML. They still redirect, but hopefully they aren't redirecting through someone that you find objectionable. Would you mind to check and let me know?

If they work for you, I've also created links to some deals on the Adaptec controller for you; they are located here on the Front Page:
http://www.aoaforums.com/frontpage/c.../view/2841/50/
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 06:07 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

Gizmo,

Thanks for your continued patience.

I tried, but the hyperlinks are gone. There is only text now.

Anyway, my drives are Seagate ST3320620AS; 7200 RPM, 16MB cache.

So, anything over PCI-E 4x is a waste of bandwidth? I suppose PCI 2.2 is not recommended either?

Unfortunately, those are my only options. It appears that the PCI-E 8x will be my best bet?

Thanks again for taking the time to explain all this.
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 06:13 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctucas
I tried, but the hyperlinks are gone. There is only text now.
I take it that you have javascript disabled then?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctucas
Anyway, my drives are Seagate ST3320620AS; 7200 RPM, 16MB cache.

So, anything over PCI-E 4x is a waste of bandwidth? I suppose PCI 2.2 is not recommended either?

Unfortunately, those are my only options. It appears that the PCI-E 8x will be my best bet?

Thanks again for taking the time to explain all this.
For your needs, anything over PCI-e 4x wouldn't really gain you anything unless you added more drives and ran a really mondo-big RAID.

PCI 2.2 is a bit different critter; as you would still be running 33 MHz, 32-bit, you would be taking a step backwards in bandwidth from even PCIe 1x (I'm assuming your mobo doesn't have 64-bit PCI slots, or support PCI-X?).
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 13th July, 2007, 10:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

Gizmo,

No, Javascript is enabled.

I only have two PCI-E 16x, one PCI-E 8x, one PCI-E 1x and two PCI 2.2.

Given my situation, would you recommend using the 1x or the 8x slot?
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 14th July, 2007, 12:38 AM
Necorum's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: January 2005
Location: Indianapolis,Indiana,United States
Posts: 1,803
Send a message via AIM to Necorum Send a message via MSN to Necorum Send a message via Yahoo to Necorum

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=AD-1430SA&c=pw

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...OTC-pr1c3watch

ON this one you could jery rig your wires to go back into your box from the outside but meh

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applicati...CMP=OTC-PWATCH

Also the only thing i could find will cost 3XX+

what about onboard solutions?
__________________
AOA Team fah


3dMark 11: P7023
3dMark Vantage: P31097
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 14th July, 2007, 12:42 AM
Necorum's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: January 2005
Location: Indianapolis,Indiana,United States
Posts: 1,803
Send a message via AIM to Necorum Send a message via MSN to Necorum Send a message via Yahoo to Necorum

cheapest way is an onboard setup whats your system specs?
__________________
AOA Team fah


3dMark 11: P7023
3dMark Vantage: P31097

Last edited by Necorum; 14th July, 2007 at 12:43 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 14th July, 2007, 01:20 AM
Member
 
Join Date: April 2005
Location: AZ
Posts: 2,446

I am currently using this card in a DFI Lanparty CFX3200 due to it having serious issues with the onboard ULI controller. I have been running it for a little over a year without any issues. It is PCI-E 4X (8X and 16X compatible). http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16816115027

Highpoint also makes a PCI-E 1X model # 2300 that works quite well, 200mb/sec sustained transfer, you take a small hit on burst transfers due to limited bandwidth but it's not something you would ever notice without using a benchmark. I have also used the 2300 and it is reliable and fairly priced. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16816115029
__________________
Biostar TForce X58 - Core i7 920 - 12GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 - EVGA 560ti - PCP&C 750W - Dual boot, Arch Linux/WinXP

Last edited by ccperf721p; 14th July, 2007 at 02:29 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 14th July, 2007, 03:14 AM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctucas
No, Javascript is enabled.
Hmm........very, very curious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arctucas
Given my situation, would you recommend using the 1x or the 8x slot?
That's really a tough question for me to answer. Here's what it really comes down to:

Is the extra 20% or so performance boost that you MIGHT see, worth the extra cost of using an x4 or x8 controller and sacrificing an x8 slot to do so?

For me, and for what I do with my machine, the answer would absolutely be yes. For you?

First off, what are your reasons for going with a RAID to start with? If your primary concern is redundancy, with performance as a secondary consideration, then going with an x1 controller would probably get you the most bang for your buck. If performance is equally in important with redundancy (or more important), then (considering that you have an x8 slot but no x4 slots, and there's no guarantee that an x4 controller will work in an x8 slot), I'd go with an x8 controller.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 15th July, 2007, 04:56 PM
weldzilla's Avatar
Metal Wizard
 
Join Date: January 2004
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,412

My Favorite Raid Controller

Has to be the wasp spray!! It kills them dang things from long range!!
It offers great control and is as easy as point and shoot!!

WZ
Attached Thumbnails
Recommend a RAID controller-raid.jpg  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 15th July, 2007, 05:50 PM
Gizmo's Avatar
Chief BBS Administrator
BassTeroids Champion, Global Player Champion, Aim & Fire Champion, Puzzle Maniax Champion, Othello Champion, Canyon Glider Champion, Unicycle Challenge Champion, YetiSports 9: Final Spit Champion, Zed Champion
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Webb City, Mo
Posts: 16,178
Send a message via ICQ to Gizmo Send a message via AIM to Gizmo Send a message via MSN to Gizmo Send a message via Yahoo to Gizmo Send a message via Skype™ to Gizmo

Weld, weld, weld.......(walks off shaking head)
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 15th July, 2007, 09:37 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 18

Gizmo,

Performance is priority.
__________________
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 16th July, 2007, 02:51 AM
weldzilla's Avatar
Metal Wizard
 
Join Date: January 2004
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,412

Well I wish I knew just exactly every piece of your system. Is this raid to be used in a typoe of home server? Here is an article on a megaraid 5 card.
Raid 5 is extremely fast and is I think the best way to insure your prized little bits of info stay safe. In a raid 5 array if you lose a hdd you can just replace it with a new one and rebuild the raid with no loss of info. A hardware raid is nice cuz you never have to worry about your operating system going corrupt and causing you to get screwed with data loss while repairing windows. A bad mobo does not hurt you. you can movce your raid to a completely different board and not have to worry about the new board supporting your raid set up. Just move the card and drives to the new rig install the software and it is back!! So do some reading and figure out which is right for you!!
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/27840/77/
Check out this article, it is a good read and perhaps will answer some questions you have.

WZ

Last edited by weldzilla; 16th July, 2007 at 02:55 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Please recommand me a IDE (raid) controller seungm81 General Hardware Discussion 5 21st June, 2003 06:53 AM
can u plug an ATAPI ZIP on the RAID controller of 8K3A+? Mad Bunion EPoX MotherBoards 2 12th May, 2003 05:20 PM
Upgrading bios of HIghpoint Raid Controller 8k9a2+? Mshake EPoX MotherBoards 2 4th April, 2003 04:01 AM
IDE RAID-5 controller choices? surlyjoe General Hardware Discussion 13 11th August, 2002 06:38 AM
8K3A+ Raid Controller BobyJo EPoX MotherBoards 1 15th May, 2002 05:51 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 01:28 PM.


Copyright ©2001 - 2010, AOA Forums
Don't Click Here Don't Click Here Either

Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0