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Intel Motherboards & CPUs Questions or comments on INTEL products?


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 7th August, 2003, 08:06 PM
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OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1

I received my OCZ GoLD-4000 series Dual Channel DDR, 2x512MB sticks, and threw them in the Epox 4PCA3+. It's not as "PATsy" as the other Canterwood boards, eschewing all the GAT type settings except for two, "Intel Memory ...CS", and "...CPC" (Coomand Per Clock). CPC is almost always Disabled, and should be with the GoLD series regardless. Where the board's strength lie is in it's VDIMM 3.30V max. Yet the Vcore is limted to 1.6V. I'm finding each board seems to have it's Achilles Heel, and they keep coming up, and hitting me on my overclocked chin.
Abit's IS7-E, and IC7-G are l;imited in their VDIMM's which both are maxed at 2.8V, yet their Vcore limit is 1.9V. The voltage is insane, for a Pentium, and is entirely unbalanced from the VDIMM? Epox is in dire need of a BIOS revision. The shipping BIOS had NO PAT settings at all! Very strang for a Canterwood mobo. As I said the revision simply offer's two "PAT-like" settings. And addresses a; "...crakcling sound while playing music" fix.

OK enough dilly-dallly, on to the benchmarks. While the newer memory, desgined to meet the arduous demands of the 875/865's NB-MCH (Memory Controller Hub) is set (SPD) with higher latencies (3-8-4-4, same as Corsair) the bandwidth is still excellent. My next step will be to reduce at least the Cas to 2.5, any attempt at enabling PAT, was initially unsuccesful. I find this is becoming commonplace at demanding higher FSB speeds. This "may" substantiate some points in my Pseudo-PAT article at Xtremesys. The specs below were obtained using a: 2.4C, SLK900U/VAntec Tornado (helicopter engine) 92mm/119CFMHSF, Epox 4PCA3+ (2.9VDIMM), PCPower&Cooling Silencer 400W; (timings are now listed in Sandra mem-bench module)
Attached Thumbnails
OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1-275fsb4000ocz6160mbs.jpg  
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Old 9th August, 2003, 10:37 PM
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I fail to see the point of PC4000 in the state that it is in now. The timings are so rediculusly high that the higher clock speed is (almost) completely offset. For example, I nearly get that score in Sandra on my IC7 running the memory at 220 MHz from a 5:4 divider. The timings are 2-6-3-2. I could probably achieve higher results than you did by simply running the memory at 225 MHz with timings of 2-6-2-2. Well, not too simply considering my Corsair PC3500 can't run quite that fast with the low voltages available with the IC7, but you get the point.
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Old 11th August, 2003, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherDude
I fail to see the point of PC4000 in the state that it is in now. The timings are so rediculusly high that the higher clock speed is (almost) completely offset. For example, I nearly get that score in Sandra on my IC7 running the memory at 220 MHz from a 5:4 divider. The timings are 2-6-3-2. I could probably achieve higher results than you did by simply running the memory at 225 MHz with timings of 2-6-2-2. Well, not too simply considering my Corsair PC3500 can't run quite that fast with the low voltages available with the IC7, but you get the point.
Ouch. I sure do. You are "TheDude's" alter-ego. Very appropropriate username.

But it's not about Bandwidth, it's about having fun running a FSB of 276MHz, that's why the thread isn't titled "6100MB/s Bandwidth to save a life."

EDIT: forgot to reply to this sorry. TheOtherDUde no I was just kidding, sorry I didn't mean to make it seem so serious, and you have some valid points about the new PC4000, the timings are silly, but there's something going on at DDR500, and i beleive it has to do, with the semiconductor industry on the whole. I don't think their on the same schedule in so far as "acaling" goes as CPU makers. I just think their either so dicombobulated tre-tooling for DDR-II, or droppping to .11-micron die, there's some reason these 4ns IC's just can't run tight?
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(2.) JIUHB1700, Prometeia, Soltek 75FRN2-L, 1GB OCZ EL-PC3700, Leadtek Winfast A250, ANTEC 480W


Last edited by Liquid3D; 21st August, 2003 at 10:19 PM.
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Old 11th August, 2003, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
But it's not about Bandwidth, it's about having fun running a FSB of 276MHz, that's why the thread isn't titled "6100MB/s Bandwidth to save a life."
I can certianly understand that.

Quote:
Ouch.
I hope that's not serious. I didn't mean to offend you. It's probably worth it, for you, just to be able to run the higher FSB.

Just out of curiosity, can that memory run at lower timings when the clock rate is slower? Say, 2-2-6-2 @ 225 MHz?
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Old 12th August, 2003, 11:31 AM
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Here's my 2.4C @ 275mhz with 2x 256MB ADATA PC4000 2.5-4-4-7 in dual channel at 3.2v 1:1 on 4PCA3+ rev 1.1 using latest official July 3, 2003 bios

I can get 1.45v in bios to read 1.68-1.71v real

unfortunately Intel Fast enabled doesn't give more than a 0.5-1% boost alot less than compared to what GAT on IC7 and Memory Performance mode on PX865PE PRO2 gives.. CPC is set to AUTO

One image is single channel 282mhz 1:1 at 3-4-4-8
Attached Thumbnails
OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1-cpuz.jpg   OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1-mem-buff-ifon-cpcauto.jpg   OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1-cpuz2.jpg  
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Old 13th August, 2003, 12:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
Here's my 2.4C @ 275mhz with 2x 256MB ADATA PC4000 2.5-4-4-7 in dual channel at 3.2v 1:1 on 4PCA3+ rev 1.1 using latest official July 3, 2003 bios

I can get 1.45v in bios to read 1.68-1.71v real

unfortunately Intel Fast enabled doesn't give more than a 0.5-1% boost alot less than compared to what GAT on IC7 and Memory Performance mode on PX865PE PRO2 gives.. CPC is set to AUTO

One image is single channel 282mhz 1:1 at 3-4-4-8
I have to admit that A-DATA ceratinly has some sweetness IC's. What are they using? Nice Bandwidth, you hit the maximum projected from the 875 NB-MCH plus some!
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(2.) JIUHB1700, Prometeia, Soltek 75FRN2-L, 1GB OCZ EL-PC3700, Leadtek Winfast A250, ANTEC 480W

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Old 21st August, 2003, 09:52 PM
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i think they might be using Hynix D43 like xms4000 and ocz pc4000 ?

here's some hynix pc3200 D43 sticks i got rated for 200mhz 3-3-3-8 at 2.5v

http://www.fileshosts.com/memory/hyn...web/hynix2.jpg

For first 2 sticks tested:

1. in dual channel max fsb drop from 275mhz to 265-270mhz and i needed 0.1-0.18v more vdimm

2. I can't run Intel Fast enabled like i can with my 2x 256MB ADATA PC4000 while in dual channel @275mhz at 3.2v

3. probably using 512MB sticks reduced oc'ing head room compared to 256MB ADATA PC4000

4. in single channel 1x 512MB Hynix PC3200 like 1x 512MB OCZ PC4000 Gold both @280mhz at 3.3v rebooted themselves in memtest86 around test #4/5 while 1x 256MB ADATA @281mhz manages to run memtest as well as run a few benchies in windows at 3.3v

2x 512MB Hynix PC3200 D43 chips @270mhz 2.5-4-4-8 at 3.3v (real 3.22-3.24v idle)

http://www.fileshosts.com/pentium4/D...pcoff/cpuz.jpg

Sandra Buffered = 6307/6232
Sandra Unbuffered = 3427/3493

Aida32 Read = 5899
Aida32 Write = 2210

PcMark2002 = 8139 / 11103 / 1085

Aida SPD info

Sciencemark = 5314.99 MB/s

Prime95 23.6 Bench

Sandra CPU = 9970 / ( 2811/6283 )
Sandra CPU Multimedia = 15008 / 22760
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Old 21st August, 2003, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eva2000
i think they might be using Hynix D43 like xms4000 and ocz pc4000 ?

here's some hynix pc3200 D43 sticks i got rated for 200mhz 3-3-3-8 at 2.5V...
Hey cover that memory up! No nudey pics here! Although I do think it "runs" better "naked"! I sure do
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Old 12th September, 2003, 08:39 PM
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I have same RAM (OCZ4KG) and have been more than happy with it. Well worth the money.
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Old 12th September, 2003, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOtherDude
.....Just out of curiosity, can that memory run at lower timings when the clock rate is slower? Say, 2-2-6-2 @ 225 MHz?
I haven't tried really fast memory so I can't be sure. But, I've heard a lot of complaints. In general, I believe that sticks meant to run 233+mhz (PC3700 & PC4000) are unable to run fast timings even at 200mhz. I'd be lying if I said I understood it completely.

Personally, I think the sweet spot in performance is in high quality PC3500... They are often offered at tight timings, eg cas2 6-3-3 or so. I tend to think the performance is very close, and you can try to overclock it for more while retaining the tight timings.
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Old 12th September, 2003, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveI
I haven't tried really fast memory so I can't be sure. But, I've heard a lot of complaints. In general, I believe that sticks meant to run 233+mhz (PC3700 & PC4000) are unable to run fast timings even at 200mhz. I'd be lying if I said I understood it completely.

Personally, I think the sweet spot in performance is in high quality PC3500... They are often offered at tight timings, eg cas2 6-3-3 or so. I tend to think the performance is very close, and you can try to overclock it for more while retaining the tight timings.
your right about that. However it's the nature of the beast at the moment. i've spoken with several memory manufacturers, and it's just not possible to get these DDR500 memories down in their Latencies, however this also has a lot to do with the Canterwood/Springdale chipsets. PAT "imposes" certain latencies within the MCH, and if the memory is tRAS-2 a conflict results. For this reason your seeing the higher timings in addition to this being the end of DDRI's life cycle. 275FSB is an amazing speed, and the bandwidth resulting from it, is quite satisfactory as well. Where people are taken-aback is on these CAS-3-4-4-8 timings. Well think about it? Were running DDR550, AND you want to reduce the timings to 2-2-2-5 Come on people, lets get realsitic. Try to remember where we were a year ago today when DDR was just relaseaed. We started out with DDR266, off a 133FSB, were now running from 200FSB, and in afct my system is totally stable at 265FSB to 275FSB and you want LL to boot (pun intended)?

And be prepared because DDR-II is going to start at high latencies as well, expect to see CAS 3-4-4-7 at DDR-II500.
Attached Thumbnails
OCZ GoLD 4000 at 276FSB 1:1-275fsbocz.jpg  
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(2.) JIUHB1700, Prometeia, Soltek 75FRN2-L, 1GB OCZ EL-PC3700, Leadtek Winfast A250, ANTEC 480W

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Old 23rd September, 2003, 03:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid3D
your right about that. However it's the nature of the beast at the moment. i've spoken with several memory manufacturers, and it's just not possible to get these DDR500 memories down in their Latencies, however this also has a lot to do with the Canterwood/Springdale chipsets. PAT "imposes" certain latencies within the MCH, and if the memory is tRAS-2 a conflict results. For this reason your seeing the higher timings in addition to this being the end of DDRI's life cycle. 275FSB is an amazing speed, and the bandwidth resulting from it, is quite satisfactory as well. Where people are taken-aback is on these CAS-3-4-4-8 timings. Well think about it? Were running DDR550, AND you want to reduce the timings to 2-2-2-5 Come on people, lets get realsitic. Try to remember where we were a year ago today when DDR was just relaseaed. We started out with DDR266, off a 133FSB, were now running from 200FSB, and in afct my system is totally stable at 265FSB to 275FSB and you want LL to boot (pun intended)?

And be prepared because DDR-II is going to start at high latencies as well, expect to see CAS 3-4-4-7 at DDR-II500.
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Old 23rd September, 2003, 03:46 AM
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Hope this is not off topic but I wanted to know if it's faster to run my system at 275fsb with a 3/2 divider @183 or 218fsb sync with mem. And don't you think my XMS3200LL are about as good as you need before DDRII and PCIexpress
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