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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 27th February, 2002, 09:48 PM
Poseidonf4
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OC Soyo 6BA+IV w/ 550 PIII and GE force II win2k

I am running a pc with a Soyo 6BA+IV motherboard and an Intel 550 pentium III. I have win 2000 installed, and I am using a GE Force II video card. I can only overclock it to 633 mhz... Any higher and windows freezes while loading. The temperature is only at about 136 degrees fahrenheight and i even tried maxing out the power to the cpu (+10%). I have a 300 watt power supply, so i doubt that's the problem. Can anyone tell me how I can get over this problem, and get windows to load?
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Old 27th February, 2002, 10:24 PM
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Welcome to the forums!

here are many factors that go into overclocking.

Some of the things that will be need to be addressed include raising the voltage (the faster you ask the processor to run, the hungrier it's going to get), keeping the processor sufficiently cooled when running at higher voltages, and the ability to keep the cards/devices running off the bus running as close to specification as possible (default is 33mhz PCI, 66mhz AGP, higher and lower creates problems, generally at about 40mhz PCI and 80mhz AGP).

First step, to determine if this is even worth the effort (since they created several types/steppings of that processor speed) is to get the information off the chip and determine if it's a cB0 or cA0 stepping. cB0 processors typically overclock much better than the cA0.

Code:
550E
SL3R3 SL3QA        cA2 0681 256K 82 14.5 2,3,4,6 
SL3V5 SL3N7        cA2 0681 256K 82 14.5 1,3,4,6 
SL44X/SL3XH SL3XH  cB0 0683 256K 82 14.5 1,3,4,7 
SL45T/SL44G SL44G  cB0 0683 256K 82 14.5 2,3,4,7
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Old 27th February, 2002, 10:26 PM
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Welcome to the Forums, Poseidonf4! The problem is the 58C CPU temp. P3E's become unreliable at about 54C. Don't believe Intel's published Max CPU Temp specs. They're a flat out lie.

A better HSF is indicated. It's possible that the volume of air flowing through your case is inadequate as well. Please post details, we'll be glad to help.
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Old 27th February, 2002, 11:31 PM
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yeah, the air flow around the case is fine, as i have the side panel completely removed (my case gets REALLY hot otherwise, like 4 udma 100 drives, and 4 udma 66 drives hot... I have just a stock heatsink and fan, w/ no thermal grease, so i'll try a dab of grease first, and if that doesn't work, a whole new heat sink and fan, and possibly a peltier cooler and/or water cooling system. I don't know there to locate the info on the chip. Is it actually printed on the chip, or can it be retrieved using software? I have WCPUID, if that can be used to retrieve it... I saved a screenshot of wcpuid, and posted it in webspace, you can pull it up at http://www.geocities.com/yetimanf4/cpu.jpg. My video card is an NVIDEA GeForce2 GTS/Pro... any other info, just ask me, or you can contact me via AIM...

Thanks!
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Old 28th February, 2002, 08:04 PM
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Ah, the problem is clear. 'Fraid that Chipzilla's stock P3E HSF(the one's with 1 Ghz P3E's are OK. Not slower processors, though) isn't good enough for even stock use.

I don't suggest pulling Intel's HSF off, in aid of puttting thermal paste on it. There's already a phase change glob(a type of thermal paste) that's already changed to perfection there!

While Slockets had drawbacks, they certainly made changing HSF's easy. The best HSF for Slocketed P3E's is arguably the Alpha PEP-66. They're still available, I'd try: www.millisec.com and www.2cooltek.com . Make sure that a PEP-66 comes with the "Version 2" clip.

GlobalWin FOP-38's also work well. They're cheaper, but they are fatter, which means that one more slot for DIMMS may be blocked than what the PEP-66 may steal from you.

Assuming that you've installed a good HSF, the oldest P3E 550's, ca2 stepping, usually attain 731.5 Mhz Clock Speed(@133 Mhz FSB) at stock Core Voltage without problems. The catch is that they run HOT. Mine ran at 731.5, but the temp was ~46C, at idle. P3E's get hotter, proportionately, than AMD K7's do when they're under load. So my P3E 550 @731.5 flirted with 54C all the dang time. I had no stability probs at first, but the processor died a long slow death. 500 spontaneous reboots later, it gave up the ghost.

The P3E 600 that replaced it(also ca2 stepping) got too dang hot at 133 Mhz FSB. I backed it down to 124 Hhz FSB. Temp was fine there, but I gave up on OCing it--because it HAD to last.

Yahoo insists that the link you gave isn't reachable. Dunno if I can remember how WCPUID's stepping information equates with Intel's, but someone here can.

Here's hoping that your 550 isn't the first stepping! Later steppings run cooler.
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Old 28th February, 2002, 10:13 PM
Poseidonf4
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ok here's an ascii copy of what wcpuid had to say...

[ WCPUID Version 3.0f (c) 1996-2002 By H.Oda! ]

Processor #1 : Intel Pentium III / 50F7EEFC
Platform : Slot 1 (SC242 Connector)
Vendor String : GenuineIntel
CPU Type : Original OEM Processor (0)
Family : 6 (-)
Model : 7 (-)
Stepping ID : 3 (-)
Brand : ----
APIC : ----
Name String : ----

Internal Clock : 632.48 MHz
System Bus : 115.00 MHz
System Clock : 115.00 MHz
Multiplier : 5.5

L1 I-Cache : 16K Byte
L1 D-Cache : 16K Byte
L1 T-Cache : ----
L1 Cache : ----
L2 Cache : 512K Byte
L2 Speed : 316.24 MHz (Half)

MMX Unit : Supported
SSE Unit : Supported
SSE2 Unit : Not Supported
MMX2 Unit : Not Supported
3DNow! Unit : Not Supported
3DNow!+ Unit : Not Supported

Host Bridge : 8086:7190.03 [Intel 440BX/ZX/DX]
South Bridge : 8086:7110.02 [Intel 82371AB/EB/MB (PIIX4)]
VGA Device : 10DE:0150.A4 [NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS/Pro]
Memory Size : 512M Byte
Memory Clock : ----

OS Version : Windows 2000 Version 5.00.2195 Service Pack 2
-------------- : -----------------------------------
StdFunc 0 : 00000002 756E6547 6C65746E 49656E69
StdFunc 1 : 00000673 00000000 00000000 0383F9FF
StdFunc 2 : 03020101 00000000 00000000 0C040843
00000017h : 60210000 00000000 00000000 00000000
0000001Bh : 00000000 FEE00100 00000000 00000000
0000002Ah : 00000000 C5080000 00000000 00000000
00000119h : 00000000 00200003 00000000 00000000
0000011Eh : 00000000 01344523 00000000 00000000

##--- Date 02/28/2002, Time 16:09:18

and here's the cache info:

[ WCPUID Version 3.0f (c) 1996-2002 By H.Oda! ]
$$--- Cache Information (Processor #1)

[L1 Information]
Instruct.Cache : 16K byte cache size 4-way set associative 32 byte line size
Instruct. TLB : 4K byte pages 4-way set associative 32 entries
: 4M byte pages fully associative 2 entries
Data Cache : 16K byte cache size 4-way set associative 32 byte line size
Data TLB : 4K byte pages 4-way set associative 64 entries
: 4M byte pages fully associative 8 entries

[L2 Information]
Level 2 Cache : 512K byte cache size 4-way set associative 32 byte cache line

##--- Date 02/28/2002, Time 16:09:18

and of course the chipset info:

[ WCPUID Version 3.0f (c) 1996-2002 By H.Oda! ]
$$--- Chipset Information

Host Bridg : 8086 7190 03 00000000 Intel 440BX/ZX/DX
ISA Bridg : 8086 7110 02 00000000 Intel 82371AB/EB/MB (PIIX4)
IDE Controller : 8086 7111 01 00000000 Intel 82371AB/EB/MB (PIIX4)
VGA Device : 10DE 0150 A4 00000000 NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS/Pro

AGP Revision : 1.0 / Enabled
(Status) (Command)
Data Rate : 1x 2x / 2x
Side Band Addr.: Supported / Disabled
Aperture Size : 64 MB
---------------------------------------------------------------
A0:[02] A1:[00] A2:[10] A3:[00] A4:[03] A5:[02] A6:[00] A7:[1F]
A8:[02] A9:[01] AA:[00] AB:[00] AC:[00] AD:[00] AE:[00] AF:[00]
B0:[80] B1:[00] B2:[00] B3:[00] B4:[30] B5:[00] B6:[00] B7:[00]
B8:[00] B9:[70] BA:[03] BB:[00] BC:[20] BD:[10] BE:[00] BF:[00]

##--- Date 02/28/2002, Time 16:09:18
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Old 28th February, 2002, 10:17 PM
Poseidonf4
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i just ordered an 80 watt peltier and a bunch of thermal grease, and I am looking into water cooling anyways (I have everything except the water block already, but I am poor as all heck so if wnyone knows how to make a home-made water block for wicked cheap, or where I can get a decent one cheap, let me know. I know that the hsf sux, i am literally too poor to but a new one though, thus the reason I am running a pIII 550.
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Old 2nd March, 2002, 11:52 PM
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I'm fairly sure that "Stepping 3" according to WCPUID means that your P3E is NOT the first(on retailer's shelves) stepping. It's probably the second "cb0" stepping. This is good news for OCing!

As you're stuck with the OEM(which means Retail Boxed in this case**) HSF for now, perhaps it's worth the effort to remove the HSF, remove the gum from the business end, then replace it with a paper thin layer of thermal paste. And reinstall the HSF. This might earn you a ~2C drop in CPU temp.

The catch is that there's a "secret" or three to removing the stock HSF the right way. Someone on the BBS knows, for sure.
I know the terrain in Poorville too, unfortunately.

**Here's the possible bright spot. If your P3E 550 is the Retail Boxed version, and it's less than three years old, Intel will replace it if it goes bad. You just have to pay for the shipping, but only to get the dud CPU to them.

There are caveats, natch. First: You never OC'd the processor, right? Second: You never ran it on a Slocket, right? Aren't you glad that you have your(S370) Asus CUBX?

"What kinda RAM you got?" asks the Tech Support guy.
"Oh, Mushkin CAS2 PC-133," you answer. WRONG. You still love PC-100 RAM, wouldn't think of wasting money on PC-133!

The argument that returning a CPU that you toasted on purpose is unethical is a strong one. I just wrote the preceding for academic purposes.

My P3E 550 died because of me. Miraculously, it had an RB S-Spec, even though it was sold to me as an OEM CPU. Chipzilla was happy to get it back, then sent me a P3E 600 to replace it. That stinkin' 550 cost me $220. My personal guilt factor doesn't keep me awake at night.

I'd stop OCing your 550, period. Until you get a serious HSF on it. Or, if it's a Retail Boxed CPU, maybe you need to see how much it can take. Your box will be K-O'd for a week while waiting for another CPU. Your choice.
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Old 3rd March, 2002, 12:05 AM
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yeah, i tuned down the oc'ing for the next couple of days, but I am just waiting for my waterblock and mounting bracket to come in, cause i have all of the other parts for my water cooler installed. My cpu was retail boxed, is there any way I can check if it is still under warrantee? also, if I wanted to "accidentally" cook my processor, what should i do, just pop off the hsf and oc it to 155 fsb? Will they be able to tell if I did it on purpose? also, should I tell them that I had it in a (S370) Asus CUBX? Will I still need a receipt or the retail box itself? Thanks for the great tip, btw i paid like $500 for my 550, cause i got it before the 600 came out, and boy was i kicking my self 2 months later when the price dropped to like $250! Who should I contact for support? thanks a bunch!
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Old 4th March, 2002, 12:11 AM
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The RMA people at Intel are said to test every returned processor--so they will know exactly what killed it. To my uneducated eye, the bad 550 I had revealed no secrets as to the cause of its demise.
"Not so," said my next door neighbor as he examined the dead 550. He pointed out a nearly invisible white line that ran kinda diagonally across nearly the entire top of the glass slug.
"Shuh," said I, "now I see it."
"This line means heat damage" quipped my neighbor. He's a genius with PC's, I'm dang lucky to have him as a neighbor!

I'd think that your 550 will die if you keep overclocking it. I think it is indeed a newer stepping than the one I had. This means that its creation of heat is less enthusiastic, therefore my exact temps that caused me trouble are not valid "specs" for your CPU.

I doubt that gross physical damage to the CPU is at all a good idea! Removing the HSF seems like it just may be too obvious. I don't recall that the RMA guy I talked to asked me for a dated proof of purchase. That the S-spec says it's Retail Boxed is a must, obviously.

Be very polite with the RMA people, you want them as friends! They are not dummies, think about your answer before engaging the jawbone. I answered the casually put question as to what RAM I had stupidly. I replied that I had a mix of PC-100 and PC-133. WRONG. As previously suggested, you're in love with PC-100 DIMMS. You definitely have an S370 mobo("What BIOS version you runnin'?"--will be asked. Let's make your mobo an Asus CUBX-E, with BIOS 1007A.), never heard of a Slocket, and don't know anything about overclocking. Except that only idiots think of such foolishness.

You gotta respond to the Q's straight up. Keep any snickers to yourself.

You can ferret out the RMA phone number with a look at the huge Web site. It's not an 800 number. I don't think that getting an RMA number is smart if the CPU is still alive. Kinda can't have your cake and eat it too.
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Old 4th March, 2002, 12:33 AM
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so could you recommend an exact cause of death for my processor? Does their warrantee cover damages caused by their stock fan dying? cause i could just unplug that crap... its pretty useless anyways... also, what do you mean by the s-spec? here's a copy of ALL the crap printed on the side of the board:

550/512/100/2.0v/s1
90070090-0052MALAY
i then there's an "m" w/ a circle around it, followed by the same w/ a "c" 98 SL3FJ
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Old 4th March, 2002, 05:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Poseidonf4
I have everything except the water block already, but I am poor as all heck so if wnyone knows how to make a home-made water block for wicked cheap, or where I can get a decent one cheap, let me know.
On your right you will see a column of our allied sites, visit "Spodes Abode". Surlyjoe has an article over there detailing how to build a "behive" waterblock. It will cost you less than a buck, I swear, and it should work fine for FCPGA Intel CPUs or with a peltier.
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Old 5th March, 2002, 03:49 AM
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ok, i have my watercooling setup running, and it rules... but i am still having problems getting my cpu to overclock. Now that heat is not an issue, i managed to oc it to 650 mhz. It will not go any higher, i suspect because of lack of adequate power. I have my motherboard's bios power settings maxed at +10%, so is there any way to jump the board to the psu and supply an extra, say, 0.3 volts? This would give me adequate power to oc it as high as i'd like, i think. If anyone know how I can hard wire extra juice into my cpu, please let me know, and please give me detailed instructions as to what hardware i will need to create a low enough voltage to not fry my cpu, but high enough to overclock the **** out of that *****.
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Old 10th March, 2002, 05:42 AM
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hey guys, just wanna say thanks a million for all the help. I know a lot about some parts of OC'ing and workin on computers, but I am not very knowledgable in other areas. I am, of course, working on that as I try my hardest to fry my cpu.
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Old 10th March, 2002, 08:26 AM
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Old 21st March, 2002, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Poseidonf4
ok, i have my watercooling setup running, and it rules... but i am still having problems getting my cpu to overclock. Now that heat is not an issue, i managed to oc it to 650 mhz. It will not go any higher, i suspect because of lack of adequate power. I have my motherboard's bios power settings maxed at +10%, so is there any way to jump the board to the psu and supply an extra, say, 0.3 volts? This would give me adequate power to oc it as high as i'd like, i think. If anyone know how I can hard wire extra juice into my cpu, please let me know, and please give me detailed instructions as to what hardware i will need to create a low enough voltage to not fry my cpu, but high enough to overclock the **** out of that *****.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news but from the cpuid you posted, you have a Katmai 500 and I'm pretty sure that 650 is as high as you will get that proc. Even Intel couldn't get a Kat to run over 600 mhz, and they had to up the vcore to do that. The thing that clued me to what you have for a proc is the L2 cache: Katmai had 512k of 1/2 speed off-die cache and all coppermine procs have 256k of full-speed on-die cache.
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Old 21st March, 2002, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by muddocktor


I hate to be the bearer of bad news but from the cpuid you posted, you have a Katmai 500 and I'm pretty sure that 650 is as high as you will get that proc. Even Intel couldn't get a Kat to run over 600 mhz, and they had to up the vcore to do that. The thing that clued me to what you have for a proc is the L2 cache: Katmai had 512k of 1/2 speed off-die cache and all coppermine procs have 256k of full-speed on-die cache.
Thank you thank you thank you!!!

I noticed the same thing, the 512kb cache was dropped on the coppermines, so it HAS to be a katmai!! Sorry it took so long for me to get back here to reply (I'm with the AMD clan now ), but equally glad someone else caught this
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Old 21st March, 2002, 09:17 PM
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thanks a bunch, it doesn't matter, cause soon enough I will be selling this POS to some sucker and getting me an XP (probly 1700) w/ some 2100 DDR, hopefully.
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Old 21st March, 2002, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Poseidonf4
thanks a bunch, it doesn't matter, cause soon enough I will be selling this POS to some sucker and getting me an XP (probly 1700) w/ some 2100 DDR, hopefully.
Thatta boy!! :-D
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Old 21st March, 2002, 09:38 PM
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anyone have any suggestions as to what board I should go w/ for my XP? looking for someone that handles DDR, preferably DDR and SDRAM, and it HAS to have ata 100 built in (I hate having extra IDE cards in my comp, they make a royal mess). Price is also a consideration, as I am nearly broke, and of course I need easy overclockability (I would prefer not to have to solder my board just to get it to a higher clock multiplier, just to unlock my processor.
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