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Intel Motherboards & CPUs Questions or comments on INTEL products?


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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 30th March, 2002, 11:03 PM
LuckyDaze
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Why No New Bios For The 4SDA+ Epox??

We have had ONE new bios for the 4SDA+ that causes lockups for everyone I know that has used it.

Now the Epox KT333 has had 5 new bios already. Is this fair to the P4 board users? Is this what we can expect from Epox if they make more money off KT333 boards but less off of the Sis 645 4SDA+ boards?

LESS MONEY=LESS CUSTOMER SUPPORT FROM EPOX

I wrote Epox 3 weeks ago about lockups in the "new" 2228 bios thru a form on the website but all I got was an automated response and no reply yet. There is no direct way to speak with a person at Epox.

If this is the support I can expect to get because the product I bought from them is not a top revenue maker, it will be my last Epox board, sorry to say that.
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 31st March, 2002, 10:50 PM
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Don't worry you're not alone. A user by the nick of cole on these forums has had plenty success with his 4SDA+

I find Epox not very willing in the BIOS department, MSI and Gigabyte are more keen on this, Asus would be another to name.

Well ultimately like you say Epox will have to get their act together or pack up and file bankrupcy. OEM's would be a bigger marker for them but since OEM's require fast BIOS updates so make their systems fully working at all times they look elsewhere like MSI, a very big supplier to the OEM sector.
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 1st April, 2002, 05:35 PM
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Hey LD, I just put together a 4sda+ and I was wondering what kind of lock ups are you having.
I locked up in the bios screen while checking the voltages but that was with the Jan. bios that shipped with the board. I flashed to the 228 bios and I'm loading xp now.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 06:32 AM
LuckyDaze
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OK,

after like 10-15 min, I would either get errors in Explorer, or it would just lock up. I set all the memory timings to slow just to be sure and still got the lock ups.

At first, I thought it was because of the Radeon 7500 fix they added to it since I have a Radeon 8500. But, my friend has the same board and a Geforce 3 and it locked up that way on him too.

Looks to me they don't even bother to test the bios out on a few
machines for more then 2 secs to see it if works. My third friend got the same results as we did. That's 3 out of 3 people having the exact same lock ups or errors. Did they fix it yet? No.

They can release and fix 6 bios for the KT333 board in 2 weeks but can't fix the 4SDA+ bios once in 3 weeks.

Why, because we're not important enough to them. We bought their product but they make more money off the other board so we don't matter any more. This tells me a lot about a company and what kind of respect they have for their customers.

It's money first, customers last. You can be SURE, if the 4SDA+ Intel board was a bigger seller then the KT333, we would see all the new bios and they would see none like us.

You just might end up in that position next time you buy one of their slower selling boards.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 12:34 PM
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IF the new bios is unstable cant you just go back to the old one ?

I doubt Epox are deliberately not working on P4 bios updates, maybee there just finding it harder to fix the problems.

What exactly was the problem with the first bios ?
And what did the new one fix ?
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 02:39 PM
LuckyDaze
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Well

number one, unlike other P4 boards, the original bios only had
simple memory setting like Normal, Fast, Turbo and Ultra along with a cas setting. Mem scores are so so. Not bad, but so so. Since you can't tweak the ram settings, you can't take advantage of the high quality memory you purchased. On top of that mem bandwidth suffers.

For the very short time I could keep the system up and running with the new bios, which had a nice detailed choice of individual
memory settings compared to the old one, mem scores improved.
These settings were more up to standards of what is offered now and in the past year.

I find it pretty hard to believe only the 3 of us, with diversified systems, have these problems. Only thing in common is the 4SDA+ and that new bios.

You would think if Epox can churn out 6 bios[money] fixes for the
KT board, they could fix the problem with the 4SDA+ bios once.

It's all money my friend. They bow to the people with the money in their wallets.
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Old 2nd April, 2002, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LuckyDaze
Well

number one, unlike other P4 boards, the original bios only had
simple memory setting like Normal, Fast, Turbo and Ultra along with a cas setting. Mem scores are so so. Not bad, but so so. Since you can't tweak the ram settings, you can't take advantage of the high quality memory you purchased. On top of that mem bandwidth suffers.

For the very short time I could keep the system up and running with the new bios, which had a nice detailed choice of individual
memory settings compared to the old one, mem scores improved.
These settings were more up to standards of what is offered now and in the past year.

I find it pretty hard to believe only the 3 of us, with diversified systems, have these problems. Only thing in common is the 4SDA+ and that new bios.

You would think if Epox can churn out 6 bios[money] fixes for the
KT board, they could fix the problem with the 4SDA+ bios once.

It's all money my friend. They bow to the people with the money in their wallets.
If its just memory tuning cant you use WCPUset to make the timings more agressive.

I dont see that you have a huge reason to complain if your just after more bios options. IF there was a bug then fair enough.

The 8k3a still has some actual bugs left in the bios...like refusing to run syncronous below 166fsb.
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Old 2nd April, 2002, 03:01 PM
LuckyDaze
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So you're saying if the board runs, and I paid money for it,
I and no one else deserves any improvements like most companies offer their customers??

Just some added bios options? How about giving us those bios options IN THE FIRST PLACE like other products offer. Then offer a bios that doesn't work and leave it on your website unfixed?

I'd like to see how you would feel if you owned this board. Believe me, I'm not the only one complaining about this. I know about this site even though I'm in the US and so I'm posting my opinion here.

In the very end, Epox will suffer because they will lose customers and sales.
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Old 2nd April, 2002, 04:06 PM
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You're right Epox will suffer in the end, it's their choice though.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 05:34 PM
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I also have the 4SDA+ and was also wondering if Epox really cares about the buyers. I'm still running the original BIOS with the crippled Memory settings cause i don't want to get the problems you guys already have. The results are about 2600 in Sisoft Sandra MemBench.

What really bugs me is the way Epox is treating its customers. No BIOS updates for P4 users, slow websites, no BIOS files at all sometimes for some boards, e.g. if i had wrecked my BIOS on my 4SDA+ shortly after i bought it, i would not have had a chance to download one from EPOX for nearly 2 months!!!

This SUXX!

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 05:56 PM
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If you ask me MSI is the best one in updating their BIOS's.

The 4BDA2+ has a problem with working with USB ZIP drives whereas Epox ignores it and states it doesn't exist. Strange how the same hardware except different motherboard makes it work flawlessly.

What's more surprising is that Epox is a small company and they don't wish to make a bigger name for themselves. For as long as they do not offer customer satisfaction after selling their board to you they will be nothing more than just a small player.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 07:42 PM
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Thx for the input LD. I wish I had talked to you before buying this board. After messing aroud with it all afternoon with no luck, I called tech support from where I purchased it and they rma'd it.
I kept locking up in the bios post screen. They said it was a bad bios chip.
After reading this maybe I'll swap it out for the Abit?
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 09:46 PM
LuckyDaze
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Well Toolman

do you know if the board you got shipped with the new bios?

The new one is the 2228 bios.

Now don't get me wrong. The board IS good. Lot's of voltage tweaks and that's the main reason I bought it. It runs fine with the original bios. The only real problem I have with it is my USB mouse seems to craps out after running Prime 95 for a few hours and bad memory settings. But the board does work good other then that.

But, as soon as I stop Prime, the mouse works again.

I know the Asus Sis 645 board is very good but doesn't allow as high a voltage tweak.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 11:12 PM
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You seem to think EPox opened this topic in our forums in order for you to criticize rather than to seek solutions. I have no trouble understanding why other motherboards DON'T do the same.

I'm moving this thread to our AMD Topic where E.T won't have to deal with such an ill mannered approach. If this type of posting continues in this topic the perps will be ban from our EPoX Topic.

Complain all you like about this decision, this IS how it's going to be.
99% of our readers come here with a problem, ask a question or three, find their solution. I see no reason on earth that ET should have to deal with the other 1%
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 2nd April, 2002, 11:13 PM
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The shipping bios was dated 01/03. It must have been one of the first boards out (serial# ended in 00000037).
I flashed to the new bios 02/28 before I read your post about lockups so I tried to flash back to the "old.bin" on the floppy and it showed an error. I did a search and found where Epox Tech posted a 2204 bios and flashed that one but it still hung in the post screen.
So far 2 doa 8k3a+ and now one 4sda.
I have NO luck!
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Old 3rd April, 2002, 03:38 AM
LuckyDaze
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Quote:
Originally posted by Daniel ~
You seem to think EPox opened this topic in our forums in order for you to criticize rather than to seek solutions. I have no trouble understanding why other motherboards DON'T do the same.

I'm moving this thread to our AMD Topic where E.T won't have to deal with such an ill mannered approach. If this type of posting continues in this topic the perps will be ban from our EPoX Topic.

Complain all you like about this decision, this IS how it's going to be.
99% of our readers come here with a problem, ask a question or three, find their solution. I see no reason on earth that ET should have to deal with the other 1%
This post Edited and it's author ban from this forms.
I moved this thread rather than delete is as ettempt to allow discussion to take place on this subject.

I could care less what people who express themselvs in this manner think of myself or our site.

If they had brain one they would leave. Lacking that they are made to leave.

Most likely not for the first time. But hey 4 clicks and they are gone again.
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Old 3rd April, 2002, 03:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LuckyDaze


No I posted here to find a solution. A solution to finding why I paid good money money for a board with no support.The solution would be a new bios and you know that. I posted what the lock up were and you know that. You are a fascist, a dictator. This is now the second time you threated people like this. I see you threated to ban GRDH20 too.

Did Epox tell you to move this thread? Well that is what people will think anyway. You have no right being a moderator of a forum.
The USA and it's allies did it's best and still those to rid the world of people like you.
LOL. I think his point was that the Epox Topic is designed for people to ask questions, not demand answers. You did seem to be inconsiderate and rude, which is probably why you're being reprimanded. Perhaps you should learn to treat authority figures with respect, whether you agree with them or not.
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Old 3rd April, 2002, 04:28 AM
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Edited by Daniel ~

Like I care what you think! LOL
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Old 3rd April, 2002, 04:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by busaganashi
EDITED
He never asked about the status of a BIOS, he simply came right out attacking Epox. THAT is why this thread has caused such a problem. If he would've simply said, "I am having these problems with my 4SDA+....Will there be a BIOS to address these issues?" then no problem would've been created. Instead, he chose to say things which he knew would upset our Epox Tech, yet expects ET to come clean about things which he may not even have control over.

I can assure that we don't receive anything from Epox; other than a tech to try to help those who have problems with their motherboards.

As for the "website owners for themselves," Dan, the owner, shells out his own money for this, in the red each month.

I hope I have addressed some of the issues you have with AOA/Epox Tech, etc.
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Old 3rd April, 2002, 04:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LuckyDaze
Superman,

I have written Epox tech support many many times before posting here. I wrote 2 people at Epox, Tony and Sam.

They didn't even bother to reply respectfully to my e-mails.

A month goes by with no reply, no answer, no acknowledgement,
nothing. How are you supposed to relate or talk to these people?
As you can see they don't care. If they did they would have responded.

I posted and asked here why no new bios for the 4SDA+. Wouldn't have easier for the ET to respond to my post and e-mails a long time ago?
Are you even sure that Tony or Sam is our ET? I'm sorry that they didn't respond to you, and I most definantly agree that is bad customer service. But I for one know that the Epox UK tech, our ET, is very prompt and helping when one sends email to his Epox branch.

Here is what I suggest you do. First, open a new thread in Epox Motherboards stating the problems you are experiencing, and what you would like to see in future BIOSes. Then politely ask ET if he knows how far they are on another BIOS for the 4SDA+ motherboard. Then see if he responds. Hope this helps, Mike.
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