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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 25th August, 2013, 09:02 PM
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Tried WinXP SP3 -- Oops! But Why?

I've been running fine on WinXP Pro with SP2 for years, but decided to give SP3 a try yesterday (advantage being access to MS security updates). I downloaded it directly from MS, installed it on my main machine and seemed to go fine, though I didn't notice the usual system startup sound clip this time. Burned it to a disc and installed on another PC I use for media (VLC, FireFox Youtube, etc). The install went OK, but afterwards there was absolutely no sound from anything. I reinstalled the audio driver, VLC, and Firefox, but still no sound, and Youtube selections would quickly stop due to some error. I couldn't tolerate that situation so I removed the SP3 update and everything was back to normal. Haven't removed SP3 from the other PC yet, but looks like I probably should.

Any idea what that's all about?
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Last edited by TrevorS; 25th August, 2013 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 25th August, 2013, 10:01 PM
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Hmm! Think I may have found the answer. MS also mentions system stability and I was experiencing problems with a runaway svchost hogging the cpu.

No sound after installing windows xp professi [Solved]
Shiva - Hardware And Networking Solutions: How to install Microsoft HD Audio UAA on Windows XP SP3
Universal Audio Architecture (UAA) High Definition Audio class driver version 1.0a available for Windows XP, Windows Server 2003, and Windows 2000
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Old 25th August, 2013, 11:31 PM
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Appears as though the problems are solved. Now I can get on with updates !
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Old 25th August, 2013, 11:35 PM
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Or/and....you could have one of these!!
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Tried WinXP SP3 -- Oops! But Why?-screenshot-2013-08-25-15-34  
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Old 1st September, 2013, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorS View Post
Appears as though the problems are solved. Now I can get on with updates !
Glad you got it resolved. I've not encountered the problem you describe with ANY of my XP boxen, and they were all on SP3 before I moved to Linux.
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Old 2nd September, 2013, 07:25 AM
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That's great you had no problems! I just yesterday finally gave up on XP SP3 on my above described multi-media box. I'd installed the latest media player and NET 2.0 with online updates, but gradually backed out NET (3.5->3.0->2.0->none) and the frequency of system failure gradually decreased (a true disaster with 3.5), but it didn't completely cease until I backed out SP3.

Perhaps it's something to do with the motherboard, but that machine never used to fail and with SP3 removed, it again seems stable. My combined media loading can be a little heavy, and so I suspect it's just an unrecognized "bug" and MS gives XP little attention anymore. I may try SP3 again later when workload drops (can always boot it again), but NET is history on that machine!
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Old 3rd September, 2013, 06:27 PM
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I don't think any of my machines supported UAA, so that might have something to do with it.

.NET on the best of days is a pig, IMO. It's greatest benefit is that it allows mediocre programmers to produce code that mostly works, in a reasonable amount of time. That's also its biggest failing (again, IMO).
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Old 3rd September, 2013, 06:55 PM
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Thank Chris, I really do prefer posts that don't try to match my humility.":O}
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Old 3rd September, 2013, 09:34 PM
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Wow service pack 2 for all those years? Crazy!!
At work we make sure to have Service Pack 3 installed... for security of course and the IE8 updates.

When I had XP at home I also made sure to have SP3 installed too. Not too many problems and they were mostly for gaming.
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Old 3rd September, 2013, 10:10 PM
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"Mommy what's a service pak?

"well a long time ago when Dinosaurs had to eat software they would get upset tummies so they would have to chew on a few dozen service paks each year...We don't have to eat service paks because we use Linux and Linux never ever makes a mistake....your father can explain the rest when he gets home dear."

(I have to do something to get the posts rolling in!!)
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Last edited by Daniel ~; 3rd September, 2013 at 10:13 PM.
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Old 4th September, 2013, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by booman View Post
Wow service pack 2 for all those years? Crazy!!
At work we make sure to have Service Pack 3 installed... for security of course and the IE8 updates.

When I had XP at home I also made sure to have SP3 installed too. Not too many problems and they were mostly for gaming.
As you said, I've had XP SP2 installed on multiple machines for a long time and they've given no significant problems. The only real issues I'm really aware of having had were internet associated and corrected by using the provided firewall (router firewall also), installing a good malware remover (Super-Antispy), and good virus protection (Avast-Antivirus).

Since I only saw degradation with SP3 and the plethora of subsequent updates (which I hoped would correct the issue, but didn't), I'm not a fan. However, it's still installed on my hub machine which so far seems OK (includes UAA as all my boards are old), but then again, it's not running multi-media. Anyway, my daily heavily net-engaged multimedia machine is again running great (SP2)!

PS. Never went past IE6 (not even when I tried SP3). Used to use Netscape, but when they quit I installed Mozilla FireFox -- still satisfied (not interested in Google Chrome).
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Last edited by TrevorS; 4th September, 2013 at 11:33 PM.
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Old 4th September, 2013, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post
I don't think any of my machines supported UAA, so that might have something to do with it.

.NET on the best of days is a pig, IMO. It's greatest benefit is that it allows mediocre programmers to produce code that mostly works, in a reasonable amount of time. That's also its biggest failing (again, IMO).
I see it as a question not of "supporting UAA", but of SP3 having a fatal flaw requiring a patch to "properly" support the older boards. As you suggest, a flaw in the patch could be the problem.

As for .NET, all I know is it appeared to take a fair amount of disc space, seemed to slow the PC, and steadily grew my post SP3-install instability problem. The original .NET package (pre 2.0) installed on XP SP2 and didn't seem to cause trouble. Guess I just have to continue avoiding apps that require .NET.
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Last edited by TrevorS; 4th September, 2013 at 11:56 PM.
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Old 17th September, 2013, 01:20 AM
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Retried XP SP3 with the UAA patch only, no further updates or packages. Was OK until I ramped up the internet multi-media activity -- not long after, the machine self-booted. That's the end of XP SP3 on that motherboard, it clearly doesn't work.
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Old 17th September, 2013, 04:54 PM
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What kind of "internet multi-media activity" are you referring to?
I've never had problems with SP3, so you must be using some extremely demanding software.
Are you using Firefox?
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Old 17th September, 2013, 09:12 PM
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Nothing demanding, I think it's something to do with simultaneous I/O streams. A combination of multiple Youtube and P2P downloads seems to open the door to it -- then just a question of how quickly it dies. Same activity without SP3 and no problems 24/7 week after week (yes, I'm using Firefox in both cases). Actual AV playback does not have to be occurring for it to happen, just the downloads.

PS. Was also playing on on-line real-time news network, but that doesn't really seem to be necessary to cause the failure.
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Last edited by TrevorS; 17th September, 2013 at 09:56 PM.
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Old 18th September, 2013, 12:09 AM
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Wow, even using Firefox huh?
All I know is Firefox, IE8 can only be updated so far without SP8. Without the newer versions/updates there will be many security holes.
If you use java too, then your box is extremely open to malware.
So of course its use-at-your-own-risk.

Since you are doing a lot of streaming I can only imagine that your performance would increase with newer version of Windows and browsers.

Too bad SP3 is bundled into one big download. If it was a bunch of patches then you could just select the ones you need.
After SP3, there is still a BUNCH more updates to be applied in XP.
Not to mention next year Microsoft is done supporting XP all together.

Have you tried messing with Linux yet? Free, fast and lots of options for any application. Of course we can help you pick the right distribution and apps for your streaming needs.
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Old 18th September, 2013, 01:46 AM
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Regarding FireFox, I'm running the most recent version. Regarding the latest version of IE, I've no reason to suppose it's more desirable than FF. The only other competition I see trumpeted is Chrome, the trumpeting largely being the result of a major marketing effort and it's amazing how heavily moved the average person is by enthusiastic marketing copy. I looked at it and stuck with FF -- no reason to change IMO.

I presume by SP8 you mean Win8. I recently first tried Win7 and after much banging my head against it (much prefer the XP UI) I'm OK with using it (not to be confused with happy) -- had to learn a few tricks to make it XP LAN compatible. I've seen nothing at all to attract me to Win8 thus far (read only criticisms online). The only reason I'm playing with Win7 is because I had to for a PC I rebuilt for a friend (a good learning opportunity), and it's needed for more recent games (DirectX 10 or later), though I do have a quasi DX10 installed on my XP SP2 machines. (As mentioned earlier, the updates following SP3 helped me not at all with the problem.)

I currently have Win7 running on two machines, my newly built core machine (server plus video crunching) and an experimental AGP gamer (experiment being the OS ). The additional disc space requirement and greater hands-off attitude of Win7 makes it less desirable to me than XP, and so I'll only make that switch when it really seems to make sense (not yet convinced it's an upgrade).

As I tried to indicate before, I'm not experiencing any security issues. As updates become available for Java and Reader and video plugins, I install them and given the protections I mention above, I'm thinking effective auxiliary precautions are more important than getting the latest MS updates. My conclusion is just because MS produces it, doesn't mean it's important to get. XP SP3 support ends March 2014 and that was the main reason I decided to try it (SP2 is already dropped). However, it clearly doesn't work on this PC. Fortunately, Avast AV is clearly doing a great job on my PC's and the most recent version even includes a sandbox mode. I'm choosing Avast over MS for security -- my experience to-date is it works.

XP SP3 is currently installed on my previous core machine (hard drives have migrated) and doesn't seem to have caused instability, but that's a different main board (also kinda old). Have yet to decide on the usage for that machine, but that's what happens with me, I tend to collect PC's ! I've no quibble with older OS and happen to like Win98. I was a purchaser of OS/2 and was enthusiastic about trying it out, but the support wasn't there and so it's merely a curiosity today.

I'm not willing to pay for multiple OS's for my multiple machines and the only ones I've bought to date have been those already installed in new machines (a total of three). I need to be able to simultaneously support multiple machines with variable configurations and all used by just me -- this does not match the MS model and so I go my own way.

Daniel informed me of Mint and I've downloaded their latest and plan on playing with Cinnamon, but my current mainstream remains MS because it's more familiar (fewer hurdles). For me, Mint is new territory and not an obvious choice for an immediate and specific need. When my PC situation becomes stable again, exploring Mint will be more attractive. Perhaps that would be a good next OS for my old core system -- as I said, it hasn't been re-tasked yet, still migrating bits and pieces of software. Actually, that's a good thought -- it would be interesting to start getting my hands wet with Mint !
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Last edited by TrevorS; 18th September, 2013 at 01:47 AM.
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Old 18th September, 2013, 02:49 AM
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I can tell from this post and your other posts that you have invested a lot of time and thought into your PC environment.
Also its quite uinique!
I too have a unique setup with all my computers and LAN environment.
So its cool to actually chat with someone who takes full advantage of the hardware and software thus saving a lot of money.

I'm sure I've posted elsewhere, but I'll post again because this is my hobby:
  • 1 Win 8 gaming machine
  • 2 Win 7 64-bit gaming machines
  • 1 Win 7 32-bit gaming machine
  • 1 Win 7/Mint 14 dual-boot gaming machine
  • 1 Win Vista gaming machine
  • 1 Win XP laptop family machine
  • 1 Linux Fedora 18 server
  • 1 Acer C7 Chromebook w/ Linux ChrUbuntu
  • 1 Window Phone

2 Extra computers not being used

I do a lot of LAN gaming with friends in my local network.
I also do a lot of PC game tests and guides in Mint.
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Old 18th September, 2013, 04:19 AM
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Cool dude!

Lacking a family, I've fewer PC usage possibilities (my compliments), but I remain a sincere fan of this crazy hardware and what it can do with appropriate software. Money is an ongoing challenge and so I typically go the highest "value" route, plus being a fan of the "underdog" my reflexive choice tends to be AMD, but believe, I look closely at what is happening in Intel-land as well.

As long as I can find ways to utilize MS OS despite their restrictions, that's my inclination (fewer uncertainties), however, I'm surely interested in alternatives. Local enthusiasm suggests Mint may be a worthwhile alternative and I would be foolish not to explore it. Fact is I'm mediocre at best as a gamer and so it's a question more of technological interest rather than expertise. Suffice it to say, I like PCs and enjoy having the opportunity to play with them !
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Old 18th September, 2013, 05:54 PM
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Ah so!

Yet if one were to involve oneself in a new OS...oh...say mint 15, Cinnamon....then one would soon have questions...questions that need immediate answers...

this sequence might even lead to extended conversations involving any number of other persons...just saying...":O}
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