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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 30th July, 2004, 05:25 PM
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EpoX EP-8KDA3J bios!

hey guys!



i was wondering if there is a good bios for the nforce 3 socket 754 epox 8KDA3J card? i got a mach II on my amd 3000+ processor and i cant see the temperature when it goes less than 0 degrees.

which bios version is the best overclocking bios?


thanks guys

// leo
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Old 30th July, 2004, 07:29 PM
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The 8KDA3+ and 8KDA3J use the same bios. I'm sorry to say the most bioses have troubles with giving the right vcore. Some undervolt by 0.15V giving 1.35V which isn't quite what the proc needs.

If you've got some Vmods for the corevoltage you can use all of them, after adjusting the vcore to the setting you want. Be aware the vcore rises under load and setting the vcore to 1.8 or higher can trigger the OVP of the board

With mods I thing 7-16 is probally the best, else I'd flash the 5-14 bios
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Old 31st July, 2004, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YoupY
The 8KDA3+ and 8KDA3J use the same bios. I'm sorry to say the most bioses have troubles with giving the right vcore. Some undervolt by 0.15V giving 1.35V which isn't quite what the proc needs.

If you've got some Vmods for the corevoltage you can use all of them, after adjusting the vcore to the setting you want. Be aware the vcore rises under load and setting the vcore to 1.8 or higher can trigger the OVP of the board

With mods I thing 7-16 is probally the best, else I'd flash the 5-14 bios
It's strange but when I try to choose 1.55 or 1.6 with 0505 I get the undervolt problem. 1.65 isn't an issue
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Old 31st July, 2004, 11:33 AM
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There is no undervolting or overvolting problem. As myself and Aedan have previously advised, please refer to the specification for the VRM and processor to understand the way that varying voltage lines are utilised.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 31st July, 2004, 12:21 PM
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Epox Tech - I really appreciated your and Aedan's explanation of the Vcore variation but there are a number of reports in other forums of this voltage variation causing boot failure by reducing the Vcore to too low a value during bootup. You will remember that in Aedan's explanation he stated that the lowest Vcore was 1.45
A 1.55v VCORE isn't over volting! In fact AMD's specifications state that the VCO requires an increase in voltage to 1.55v in order to remain stable through some ACPI state transitions. The processor itself changes the VID pins to enable this increase in voltage. During P state transitions, a stock processor will go through VCORE voltages of 1.45V, 1.475V, 1.5V, 1.525V and 1.55V. When the processor is idle, the processor's P state will leave the VID pins set to 1.45V.
This is one of the comments
OMG, nevermind, I was just over reacting. It doesn't fix my Vcore fluctuation issue. The next reboot, I had a cold boot which I had to reset my jumper again after flashing to the lastest BIOS. At the end, my system won't boot if i leave it default at 1.55v which then drops down to 1.35-1.40v during bootup. I had to raise my vcore setting to at least 1.6-1.65v to avoid system instability. The Problem still exists...
There are are also other comments implying that Epox are aware of the problem and are working on it.
Would you like to comment further on this.
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Old 31st July, 2004, 12:36 PM
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I will comment but will have to continue to state that it is symptoms experienced by those without knowledge of the specification or the application of the electronics that make for incorrect theories made by those without knowledge of the specification or the application of the electronics.

There certainly isn't a problem (not to be interpreted as there is a problem that they are keeping quiet about), but there certainly are some theories that make for very light hearted relief! Perhaps one should look at the 5VSB current load provision that is available during these ACPI states where the CPU is VID pinned back to origin and then re-asses the comment that they make.

I have no re-boot or stability issues with my system which invariably depending on what memory is passing through the office is far more overclocked than 90% of other systems out there.

I know it may sound all like a very bullish defense however I can't read things that are un-true or un-founded, or are made without any grounding without stating some baseline facts.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 31st July, 2004, 01:03 PM
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Thank you for the quick reply.
As you will appreciate I am not an electronics expert but I am trying to understand what is happening before I complete installation of my new Epox system this evening - the hold up was not enough spacers for the motherboard would you believe.
Can you please clarify a couple of points.
Is Aedan correct in stating that the lowest Vcore should be 1.45 volts. If so what could be the cause of the reported 1.35 - 1.4 Vcore other than the response of the motherboard to the processor voltage request.
You refer in your reply to the the 5VSB which I don't understand as I thought that this only provided enough power to kick off the boot sequence and initiate the other rails. Even my Tagan 480 watt PSU only gives 2.5 amps on that line and that is one of the highest values I have seen.
Have done a bit more digging and found this
At min. P-state, a CG-rev part is clocked at 1000MHz with a 22W max. power-consumption at 1.10V Vcore(CPU-voltage) whereas the older C0-rev parts are clocked at 800MHz with a 35W max. power-consumption at 1.30V Vcore
However this appears to be related to Cool'n'quiet. If this is disabled why would the Vcore vary.
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Old 31st July, 2004, 07:19 PM
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I have a friend who has a 8kda3+ and a 3200+ 2ghz 1mb L2 C0.
and nothing is oc and C&Q is disabled.
I have try all the from bios from 5/5 to 28/7,and it the same.
Vcore
Auto > 1.35v under boot cant load windows (crash)
1.55v > 1.35v under boot cant load windws (crash)
1.60v > 1.52v under boot can load windows but crash in games.( vcore in win is max 1.53v)
1.65v > 1.60v under boot can load windows and run all games ( vcore in win is max 1.66v)

i have done vcore mod on my mb so i dont have the problem.

sorry for my English
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Old 31st July, 2004, 09:49 PM
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I flashed my 8krda3+ to the 7/16 wich is the newest according to magic flash and i dident get any problems with vcore, but instead the cool `n` quiet control disapeard in the bios ?? Its not even in grey anymore. im using a 3400+ 2400MHz cpu
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Old 1st August, 2004, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finetobe
I have a friend who has a 8kda3+ and a 3200+ 2ghz 1mb L2 C0.
and nothing is oc and C&Q is disabled.
I have try all the from bios from 5/5 to 28/7,and it the same.
Vcore
Auto > 1.35v under boot cant load windows (crash)
1.55v > 1.35v under boot cant load windws (crash)
1.60v > 1.52v under boot can load windows but crash in games.( vcore in win is max 1.53v)
1.65v > 1.60v under boot can load windows and run all games ( vcore in win is max 1.66v)

i have done vcore mod on my mb so i dont have the problem.

sorry for my English
"Auto > 1.35v under boot cant load windows (crash)
1.55v > 1.35v under boot cant load windws (crash)"

and epox tells us this is no problem (no it's a feature!!!)
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 2nd August, 2004, 03:06 PM
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Just thought I would check what my 8KDAJ is doing on bootup as I have no problems.
Vcore on bios first screen 1.6 volts
Vcore when idle from Epox Monitor 1.52 volts
Cool'n'quiet disabled
Bios 5/5 everything at default
This is how it should operate in my opinion with a fairly high boot Vcore settling back when loaded - perhaps Epox Tech will comment on this.
Vcore 1.6 volts running Prime 95 at priority 10 - only problem things got a bit too hot so new case fans needed.
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 05:14 PM
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I've got the same problems with the 7-16 bios as well.

1.55 in bios = 1.39 at post health monitor and 1.41 in windows under load (mine does boot at that low voltage if I underclock my 3000+ CG to 1800 mhz)
1.60 in bios = 1.46 at post - 1.49 in windows under load
1.65 in bios = 1.53 at post - 1.55 in windows under load
1.70 in bios = 1.70 at post - 1.72 in windows under load

With the old 5-5 bios and C&Q disabled, the set voltages would be within 0.05 volts of the reported volts under load in windows.

I don't really have an issue with this though, as I simply set it to 1.7 where my cpu can OC to 2488 mhz on the stock heatsink/fan at @ 47 degrees with some AC ducted cool air. Can't wait for a better cpu heatsink/fan.
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 06:27 PM
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Funny, I've read a lot about this undervolting problem but I haven't experienced it. I wonder if only some boards have the problem...
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 06:29 PM
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What problem ? The mainboard is operating within the window of the specification of the VRM!
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 06:30 PM
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Perceived problem then...
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 07:16 PM
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Hi EpoxTech,

Alright, I'm curious though, could you please explain why the different bioses change the way the different voltage settings are being applied as per our posts. Something has changed from 5-5 to 7-16. I understand that this is not a dire problem, it's just strange that the automatic voltage setting could render a board with the 7-16 bios incapable to boot into the OS while the 5-5 bios happily sets the voltage to ~1.5.

Thanks!
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 08:20 PM
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One thing for sure I am not updating my bios until I am sure I will not have problems.
The 05/05 bios is working great for me and the CPU and system temperatures are reading accurately, unlike the MSI boards which was one reason why I didn't get one, and give me confidence in eventually overclocking once I improve my case cooling.
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EPoX Tech
What problem ? The mainboard is operating within the window of the specification of the VRM!

oh - i see, "The mainboard is operating within the window of the specification of the VRM!"

but IT IS NOT EVEN STABLE TO BOOT WINDOWS

that is the problem

if i select AUTO in the bios, i get 1.3x vcore @ boot and windows cannot even boot - don't tell me that is in the """"specification""""

i said that 4 weeks ago - and NO ONE of epox replied to this PROBLEM
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Old 2nd August, 2004, 11:34 PM
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I sorry, we won't be telling you anything in this topic as it's now closed to you.
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Old 3rd August, 2004, 09:37 AM
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Hi there all.
I have seen this undervolting on my board only once and that was after a bios flash. Since then it has never happened again. I personally think it not a problem, but more like a glitch. Only seems to happen on certain boards and that makes me think there is another device in the system that is the culprit. Currently I am using the newest beta bios on the net and my system is rock solid.
I hope you guys comes right with the problem.
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